What they say about E2NZ.org

free speech

There is an illusion of free speech in NZ – in reality its a very closed, self censoring society

17 Feb 2013

We recently had this post brought to our attention, it was published on the forum at TradeMe.co.nz where the author said this about E2NZ.org

It is also full of incorrect and misleading information that has been re worked by the owner. To be honest a lot of his writing is rumour and opinion not fact…also given that they like to take snippets from peoples posts on here as “evidence” to back up their opinions or views really says it all.

Our writing is always based on facts, mostly from official statistics, published academic papers and reports – national and international, news items and first hand testimonies. Opinions borrowed from sites like Trademe are used to demonstrate the ‘Clapham omnibus‘ POV, not to be regarded as factual.

Sedition?

Our aim is to raise awareness of the issues present in New Zealand as a counterbalance to the hype put out about the country. We also exist to provide a support network for migrants, and as a safe place where they can speak their minds and let off some steam:  a safe place with zero tolerance for trolls.

We’ve seen comments that say this site is ‘bordering on sedition‘ we say ‘You need to look up the history of that word in New Zealand.

Are you sure you have a right to free speech in New Zealand?’ Has the recent Dirty Politics scandal, and the treatment of Bradley Ambrose,  Nicky Hager, Glen Greenwald and Eleanor Catton changed your perception of that at all? Do the repeated name suppression scandals of “prominent New Zealanders” make you wonder why you need to be kept in the dark about some things?

See our Welcome page for further information

If you looked at many countries criminal and violence all assembled in one place it would make ours look pitiful.

Violence and crime in other countries is the reason why so many people express a desire to move to New Zealand. This desire features very highly in the aspirational marketing put out by the country, both for tourism and emigration.

Our aim is to show that New Zealand has exactly the same problems as other developed nations, plus a few that are unique to New Zealand – for instance its low wage v. high cost of living, geographical and cultural isolation, a strongly bi-cultural society that by default excludes multiculturalism (something that affects migrants deeply), an ingrained gang culture that goes back generations, and a high proportion of its citizens living overseas.

There are more but we’d like to hear from you our readers what you think they are, this is your site after all. You guide it and take it where it needs to go.

I suspect the person running this website has never travelled beyond their town…

Everyone involved in this website is, without exception,  someone who has travelled thousands of miles to emigrate or study in New Zealand.

We have all travelled “well beyond” our towns, skilled migrants and students who’ve experience of other many countries against which to measure New Zealand from an international perspective.

But let’s not make the site about us – it’s about the issues that affect migrants in New Zealand.

Like what you read on this blog, want to follow comments or E2NZ.org’s tweets? click on the links in the sidebar to follow us, you’ll be in good company. More importantly, if there’s something you want to talk about here please contact us by leaving a message.

32 thoughts on “What they say about E2NZ.org

  1. Thank you for creating this site. I do hope that will prompt the New Zealand government to address our slackness on safety issues. Even the highly preventable deaths of 29 miners, in 2010, changed nothing. Our actual government doesn’t listen to us, New-Zealanders. Perhaps it will listen to you? Good luck with that, and all my sympathy to the bereaved families.

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  2. Thank you very much for the huge volume of information on this site. Some of the stories are extremely unsettling but I’m glad I found you.

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  3. Thank you for setting up this site as Im sure my own personal experience was not welcomed to be heard and fear personal danger or murder for speaking out, that the people who mugged or damaged me so much wanted me discredited, smeared, outcasted and silenced. well, so much they want to exploit and destroy you, the truth is the truth. even if they send an FBI or spy to locate me and murder me or any siblings, if you dare to slaughter people alive and you do so ruthlessly, so be your evil side be witnessed and known.

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  4. “plus a few that are unique to New Zealand…geographical and cultural isolation, a bi-cultural society that by default excludes multi-culturalism”

    Personally, I would consider those upsides, particularly the first one. Look at what globalization and multi-culturalism (specifically in the religious aspect) has done to my country.

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  5. Thankyou so much E2nz for allowing people freedom of speech and to voice their honest opinion about how they find things.
    On another blog called britishexpats.com I put a post about how expensive Nz is – there was nothing in my posts that was offensive to anyone or any race or gender or anything like that, I was just saying how expensive the cost of living is including the cost of medical etc and this is the reply from the moderator of that forum –

    It’s Friday . I await the start of the weekend down my neck of the woods and so have time for a wee chat.

    You will note that your posts into the Welcome Inn have been deleted due to the content and tone. Why you would feel the need to try and put the willies up a brand new BE user in the Welcome Inn escapes me. That’s not kind. It’s not fair and it’s not on.

    I have now felt it necessary to come in under 2 of your latest posts in the NZ forum to make it clear to all other posters looking in that your manner of utterly damning an entire country via inaccurate info and wild sweeping statements is not considered the ticket.

    I’ve decided you are not posting to share or to offload. You are posting in an attempt to frighten and dissuade.

    That’s not in the spirit of BE at all so please note that this is to stop from now.

    Any argument you may have to the contrary that you feel some sort of duty to enlighten the ‘unsuspecting’ will not wash . There are plenty of posts referencing the likes of COL, dentistry, property prices etc. so the balance is already there without you pouring entire buckets of misery about the place.

    I do hope that this will be the first and last conversation we need to have. You see, for me, it is all about the balance.

    BEVS
    Moderator.
    __________________
    LEST WE FORGET

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    • Ah, that’s the normal (from control freaks in fluff websites). Passive-aggressive behaviour, while being polite.
      Messages being censored on E2NZ is very rare (HUGE THANK YOU TO THE MODERATOR/SITE CONTROLLER):
      because while people need to know the downside, they should also have a look at examples of rabid Pollyanna-ism (it’s entertaining seeing the swear words come up, glad they’re too far away to give the bash) and how debate online happens regarding NZ and its appearance towards migrants.

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      • Thanks P Ray et al for the feedback, its good to know we’re on the right track.

        We rarely censor messages on E2NZ and allow people to be honest and open with their opinions. You’d be surprised how much criticism we get for allowing free speech here, as if all talk of New Zealand has to be audited somehow. Maybe that suggests there is something of a sect mentality in the country?

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    • (in reply to Jo) Balance. Ha that’s a joke. It’s about cash through the door, keeping the present incumbents and coming back for more. Scare off the punters and you’ll get a warning. These people have to make money you know.

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      • @Rufus it is clear that emigration forum is a commercial operation being run as a business. People should treat it accordingly.

        Whilst E2NZ.org occasionally carries ads generated by WordPress.com these provide no revenue to us, nor would we ever switch to any form of sponsorship or inducement. We would prefer to keep our integrity and value our readers too much to have it any other way.

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    • This is quite old so I dont know if it is still current or even read anymore.

      The same mod on BE- BEVS from Mapua is not able to hear the opinions of others.

      I was banned from BE after a few PM’s with her where our opinions differed, she was unable to accept a view different from her own.

      A number of forum regulars on BE appear to have formed a clique with BEVs at the head of that table.

      Biased, partonising and condescending.

      Let me add that I found this site when googling the pros and cons of NZ – I do not dislike living here even after 5 years.

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      • You have to understand there is a culture of censorship in New Zealand, long term migrants eventually succumb to it and don’t realise they’ve become part of the group-think. That, and the fact the site is commercial and has advertising revenue to consider – bad news is bad for business.

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  6. I agree with you PRay. I can understand a post being deleted if people are offensive about someone but not if they are just giving their opinion on a place. It is like having a one-sided debate. If you look at the posts on that website britishexpats.com so many comments are put in by the moderators that are from nz and so many posts deleted – they delete them if they don’t agree with your opinion on the place. Some of the poor brits coming to Nz must feel like they’ve been conned. I mean its a great place Nz – nothing like a warzone or full of terrorism, clean etc, but it has cons like anywhere.
    This poor british couple in the late 40’s were fed up with Britain and had a farm in the countryside and were thinking of selling and moving to Nz to get a better standard of living and warmer climate- they wanted cheaper and warmer. I told them that Nz weather is very similar – if not worse in the south island winters of late and cost of living more etc and this post was deleted and the above comment put in by the moderator.

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    • South Island winters can be very harsh, there’s probably few farmers on British Expat sites. Those that do have a few acres are usually nothing more than smallholders or hobby farmers, producing small quantities of animal products, wine or olives – not really enough to make a decent living. Very few of them rely on farming as their sole source of income. Even specialist forums like http://www.lifestyleblock.co.nz are more suited to ‘weekend farmers’ and the occasional Tom and Barabara.

      Good on you for trying though.

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  7. Put the willies up a brand new user? Not “fair”? That tells you everything about the purpose of the site. To funnel people TO NEW ZEALAND, not to give them a balanced view of the pluses and minuses of living there. If she moves to New Zealan,d she’ll find the willies up her soon enough, tell her not to drop the soap. ;P

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    • Perhaps those types of sites should openly declare their conflict of interest and leave place-markers where negative comments have been edited or deleted?

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  8. Bear in mind they are there to assist with emigration, not put people off. How else are they to make their money? Thank you for being upfront with your site E2NZ, wish there were more like it.

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  9. Well done e2nz.org. How refreshing it is to read the home truths that are on this website. It gives us a safe place to vent our disappointment and frustration.

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  10. Been two months here, still love the country, i still feel this is the best place to live if you have a good job or business, a few rotten apples are bound to be there in any country.
    Climate is good, Education is good, Food is good, Crime is less, what more does anyone want.

    The cons are high cost of living, less jobs and poor business opportunities and a few unethical professionals.

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    • You’re in what’s called the Honeymoon Period, enjoy it whilst it lasts.

      What more does anyone want? Read our Migrant Tales

      Some of the recurrent themes we’re seeing are

      Low salaries
      Problems finding work, overseas qualifications not recognised by Kiwi employers
      Xenophobia, racism, bigotry and discrimination
      Expensive, poor quality accommodation
      Problems with the education standards
      A lackadaisical attitude towards safety and security
      Feeling that NZ is actively mis-sold to outsiders
      Isolation, missing family, friends, old lifestyles etc.
      Crime and a frustration with the way its dealt with
      High cost of living -especially food, “Rip off NZ” etc.
      Lack of culture
      Dangerous roads and drivers, drinking and driving, hoons
      No future for kids, older kids feel isolated and cut-off from friends and family, no support networks.
      Bullying problems in schools and workplaces, harden-up attitude, not knowing where to turn for effective counselling services
      The ‘Kiwi way’, ‘WWINZ’ (won’t work in NZ) small mindedness, #8 wire mentality, etc.

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    • I am glad that you are enjoying the honeymoon phase. You need to spend a winter in a New Zealand house and deal with Kiwis long enough to catch on to the lamentable realities of New Zealand, unless you happen to be like them.

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  11. I am glad we found your website. We were planning to migrate, but thanks to this excellent and honest site we have now decided that we will not do it. Thankfully we haven’t handed any money over to anybody. The life we have in UK sounds like its pretty good compared to over there. I wouldn’t throw it all away to end up worse off, isolated, broke and unhappy.

    Liked by 2 people

    • The admin team is aware of this subreddit (it appears in our referrer list occasionally, though we refer more people to reddit than it does to us). However, we know that many reddit users support this site and therefore we pay no heed to the few who are threatened by its existence and feel the need to troll it.

      Fortunately, we manage to keep this a safe place for all of our readers.

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  12. I’m a NZ migrant whose been in NZ since the sixties, and who displays loyalty to genuine friends and associates.

    When I first came across E2NZ, I dismissed it as sour grapes, and resigned myself to a statement that ‘all places are shit.’ I had a read here, then went away for some years.

    Though a security program began to operate in the back of my brain CPU, and has been trickling along using few resources for a few years, here in ‘wonderful’ NZ.

    I believe this ‘security scanning program’ was now scanning all experiences, all site visits and connected experiences, that I experienced as a human being residing in NZ.

    So, I just got the report.
    NZ is full of bugs.
    Viruses that self replicate and trojans that get past our firewalls.

    Download the free trial version of E2NZ, and make your machine run faster, dont waste your working memory on resource hungry entities that damage the running of your machine.
    Free up your working memory.

    I feel lighter and more joyful than I have in a long long time.

    Thanks again E2NZ

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