We Chose To Go With New Zealand. BIG MISTAKE

Missouri Mountains

The Mountains of Missouri

15 April 2010

Continuing in our very popular series of Migrants’ Tale – first had accounts of the migrant experience in New Zealand taken from locations around the net. For hundreds more Migrant Tales in the series click here – link.

Our Singaporean readers may also find these interesting: Moved from Singapore for a better life and articles tagged Singapore.

This message was published on a members only internet Group, a hybrid between an electronic mailing list and threaded internet forum with hundreds of members. This is a common way for intending and existing emigrants to exchange information about New Zealand.

The author is an American from Missouri, neither her nor her partner are currently working in their trained fields. Earning low wages and eating into savings means that they are now trapped in New Zealand and having to make the best of things (some information has been removed in the interests of privacy):

“Hi there,

I have been following this thread for a few days whilst I was on Holiday at Lake Tekapo. I guess it is my turn to chime in.

September 11, 2001 was our 10th wedding anniversary and we had decided that to spend it in New York as we were working and living in Toronto at the time.
Well, you know how that turned out. To this day certain smells and noises make me jump & shudder. We were wanting to “settle down” and start a family. I am a Registered Nurse in Canada, Israel, Missouri, Kansas, Oklahoma & Texas, Hubby is a licensed Civil Engineer (PE) in Australia, New Zealand, Canada, Missouri, Oklahoma & Kansas. He is also a secondary teacher with a specialty in Math & upper sciences in the state of Missouri and has his teaching credentials assessed at Level 7 certificate for New Zealand.

We decided to apply to BOTH Australia and New Zealand at the same time with *** being the primary in New Zealand (as NZ had not approved my nursing yet) and I was primary in Australia (who were happy to assess based on USA experience but NOT Israel). Australia replied about 4 weeks later offering us a 2 year work visa contingent upon my finding work as a nurse in Australia. New Zealand offered us Permanent Resident with no strings attached other than we pass the physical, criminal checks and arrive within 6 months to take up residency. We chose to go with New Zealand. BIG MISTAKE.

We arrived in 2004 and I can say I have been utterly SHOCKED at how our lives have changed. Neither me nor my husband are working in our trained fields. We have absolutely NO money nor savings left after 14 years of professional work in the USA. It took 9 months for my husband to get a job at KMart. A year later he was able to get an entry level position as an orderly at the hospital (only because he was willing to work nights). He continues to work there today earning just above the minimum wage. I went round and round with the Nursing Council & decided to do IVF (FREE) and have a child rather then fight with them about schooling. I was shocked to learn that New Zealand would “pay” me to sit at home and have unlimited numbers of children through Work & Income, Housing Allowance, Day Care Subsidy& Tax Rebates at birth. Not a professional salary, but way better then trying to work an entry level position(AND have to pay for daycare).

Brillant for a professional mums wanting a break, but no motivation or incentive for average or minimum wage earners to return to work. In fact, I know of several families who are trying to have more children strictly for financial reasons as they have no training nor skills. Talk about a nanny-welfare state!!!

OK for the good and the bad IN MY OPINION:

Let’s start with the good:
I love the medical system here and find it to be one of the most fair in the world. Should you want care that is not included (as we did with certain fertility treatments) the prices are very reasonable compared to other countries. I never worry about scripts or my child falling ill. I have found the doctors to be VERY well trained and competent (though the nurses and midwives are lacking even the most basic skills such as IV’s) and I have found ALL medical personel to be MUCH MORE compassionate then in the US, Canada or
Israel. You can ring an office at 9am and have your child seen in the afternoon. PLUNKET is a GREAT organization for both mums and babes-care in the home after birth is marvelous here. TOY LIBRARIES are fabolous and very economical.. .can’t believe that we didn’t have them in the US. BABY CHANGING ROOMS in the mall are like mini-hotels- equipped with recliners for breastfeeding and videos for the older kiddys to watch.

TRANSPORT:PRAM ACCESSIBILITY is great with all the busses lowering or having ramps. I have to use the bus system as we can no longer afford to operate a car on our income. I find the prices to be VERY reasonable and you can get just about anywhere at anytime in the city on one.

Schools: I like the fact most schools are uniformed and think it is great that dental clinics are on our school grounds. Manners seem to be a BIG part of the Kiwi education in primary schools. My 2 year old has been taught to say yes please and no thank you. Very impressive to her American grandparents. Regular dental checks are as common as eye checks here. Librarys are a GREAT resource in this city with free WiFi and internet access(although even high speed is very slow)

Jobs: All jobs start with a minimum of 4 weeks paid vacation in addition to sick leave and holidays. Enough said.

CLOTHING-two words:Merrino wool. GREAT!!!!

CHILDHOOD: We were out driving one day with friends and found ourselves on a beach with no preparation. I wanted *** to have a play. Lifeguard went to get her a sand pail and told us to just “let her strip and run”. We took some very innocent photos & sent them “home”. My parents “had a fit”-not a single Kiwi cared as half of their kids were running naked as well. It is more important to a Kiwi that your child be warm and mismatched then matching and freezing cold. While visiting the States my in-law’s refused to take 12 month
old *** out one day until we changed her socks so they matched her dress. Holiday Parks and Batches-the ONLY way to afford vacation if you live on Kiwi salary long enough. They are VERY economical and you will find most of them to be quite clean, well kept and GREAT for kids to just run and be kids. Kiwi kids know how to “get dirty” and play with nothing more then some dirt and a stick. Right now *** is entertaining herself with laundry pegs and a watering can.

FOOD: We DO eat much more healthy then in the US-but we do so out of “poverty”. Healthy eating has never been an issue for me and my family and we find the “basic” food items to be the only ones that we can afford. Yes, we eat seasonally and yes I have learned to like my fruit and vege’s. I do cook HEAPS more then I use to in the US. I think it is better that kids have to take their lunches to school (for the most part) and you cannot find Burger Kings and McDonald’s in the school cafeteria like you do in Lee’s Summit Missouri.

KIWI’s-are quite reserved and distant for the most part, but there are those naturally “friendly” ones. MOST Kiwis are basically honest and look out for the safety of children. When my child went missing for a few minutes last month I was more worried that she had fallen into the Avon River then that she had been kidnapped or worse. At large scale events Kiwis often write their mobile phone numbers down the side of their child’s arm so they can find someone to ring Mummy or Daddy should they get lost in the crowd. Can’t imagine that in the US!!!

Now for the not so good:

COLD LEAKY UNINSULATED HOMES-I find it APPALING the whole heating issue. Your heating bill will be hundreds of dollars and you will still be cold. You would think people who settled a country could figure out how to build a decent house to keep you warm. Prices are very high for sub-standard housing.

MEDICAL:Although Jewish I do have hints of Midwest conservatisim in my blood and do NOT like the fact that my child can seek reproductive health care (BC pill & abortion) WITHOUT my knowledge nor consent at the age of 14!!! I find the level of RN’s training to be less that that of an LPN in the States. Kiwi’s tend to take great pride in sub-standard credentials and training.

TRANSPORT-there are HEAPS of old clunkers that are dirty and loud on the roads. We cannot afford to own and operate a vehicle because of all the WOF requirements without changing something else in our lifestyle. Boy Racers are a royal pain and the police tend to have a very “boys will be boys” attitude when dealing with them rather then enforcing the law.

CRIME-while I do not worry when walking down the street with my child about being “mugged” or attacked, I find the “petty” and “annoying” crimes to be MUCH more prevalent then where I lived in the States. As stated, boy racers are annoying, loud and dangerous. There is a VERY VERY serious alcoholism problem in this country, not just drinking but “binge” drinking that you usually do not see until college in the States. Graffiti is EVERYWHERE. The only country I have seen that smokes more than Kiwi’s are the Israeli’s. I see more teenage drop outs and kids doing nothing then I ever saw in the suburb’s of Missouri. Teenagers seem unmotivated & many seem to lack direction.

SCHOOLS-my mother-in-law does International Intakes (in the States) of chilren who are returning to the USA for her school district. She USE to say that the Brit’s were the worst in testing. She says in the last ten years she has seen that the Kiwi’s are BY FAR the least motivated, and most behind of any country she has seen short of refugees. She says that they do not even know how to take the test. Handwriting is awful and most teenagers cannot do multiplication without a calculator or even count change back properly. There is no record of testing, grades, conduct or reports. She has begged me to “homeschool” *** if we are going to remain here (it’s just not in my blood) and tells me that by age 8 *** will be a good 2-3 years behind her American cousins. There is only ONE school (per gender) in the whole of the South Island that offers the IB program which is the ONLY credential from New Zealand that colleges and Universities abroad will recognize. It also costs $18,000 a year to send your child there as it is a private school. It is not uncommon for “professional” Kiwi parents to take their child out of public schools at age 14 and place them there for the IB program if they can afford to do so.

JOBS-there is nothing for me to add to this other then the fact that MANY of the jobs that are advertised have already been promised or given to a family member or friend and they are only advertising because the law says that they have to. There is NO sense of fairness or “the best person for the job”-I feel like I live in one great big social “gool ole boys club”. My husband ROUTINELY sees that the “Asian” nurses often get the hard or difficult assignments at work. There is Anti-Americanism, but it is not so much the fact that we are American as it is the fact we are not Kiwi-born. Most people who dislike Americans tend to avoid us rather then confront us.

CLOTHING-expect to pay Dillard’s prices for Walmart quality. Not much in colour (unless you like pink). But then, EVERYONE is in uniforms, so clothing is not as big a deal over here. An expat friend brought *** a dress with tights and leggings last year with the Walmart price still on it. It has outlasted three other dress bought at the Mall here for TRIPLE the price -and she loves it so much the dress has become a tunic. Walmart quality is better then any quality you will find here other then wool products.

FOOD-from someone who is NOT organic or natural and does not care about such things I find the food to be VERY expensive for very little quality with the exeption of yogurts. Sweet corn was the same price as I paid in the USA last week, only the quality is what the Missouri farmers us to feed to the pigs. Not even yellow with many kernels missing.
I miss the simple naughty things:Cool Whip to mix with JELLO (jelly here gets a film on the top), VELVEETA cheese blocks for yummy nachos, HO HO’s, Ding Dong’s Quicktrip fountain drinks & Prime Rib steaks. I also know that this is just a part of adapting but basic food prices are higher here then in any other country which I have lived. I am totally bored as it is unusual to get new products down here. I did get lucky last week and found Chips Ahoy Chocolate Chip cookies for .99 cents a package. I asked why they were so cheap. “We have to get rid of them. None of the Kiwi’s are buying them, they don’t like new foreign stuff down here.” I can get Reeses Peanut Butter Cups now at the cost of $1 PER CUP and Dorrito’s have just arrived. I really hope that Kiwi’s decide to like them.

KIWI’s-I find most of the adults to be quite friendly and pleasant to your face, but that does not mean you will ever be invited over for a cup of tea. They have their cliques and groups of friends and many of them have been “best mates” since grade school. Being an outgoing person I have found myself to be MUCH MUCH more happy when I decided to stop focusing on the Kiwis and just look around. In the last four years I have developed a “core” set of friends-on is Dutch, one is a Brit, one is from Seattle, one German and we all get on great. WE are family. WE go away for holiday’s together and split the cost. The only problem with this is you will find that every year one or two people come and go, and this can get hard emotionally. That is how it is with expats…very few actually come here to stay even though they may THINK that they are at the time. Once again, it often winds down to a job. Had we not had ***, I’m not sure that we would have financially been able to stay.

RUGBY: Other then half-time on Superbowl Sunday,I ignored football in the States and once in a while would watch baseball. I’m just not a sports type of person. I thought that football fever was bad in the States, but it is NOTHING compared to Rugby down here. It seems to be the ONLY thing that Kiwi’s care about. And it seems to be the ony thing (other than weather) that Kiwi’s can hold a conversation about. I feel like it is contantly being “shoved down my throat” and more then one Kiwi has said that I will never be a “real Kiwi” until I learn to follow and care about Rugby. VERY ANNOYING.


1. We cannot afford to. As stated we have blown through ALL of our saving’s are are now living on minimum wage & Work & Income. We feel TOTALLY trapped here. We would have to move in with our in-laws and attempt to find work in the American Recession.

2. We have just applied for citizenship and are saving up money to get our Kiwi passports. It now takes 5 years of living and employment to qualify.

3. *** was Kiwi conceived, Kiwi born and the least we owe her is a Kiwi childhood. I want her to skinny-dip, fly-fish, dirt bike, skateboard, swim in glacier fed lakes, jump from trees, horseback ride, drink from a stream, trust adults, sleep in a tent, ice skate under pine trees, etc. Our goal is that she will have fond memories of her childhood in New Zealand before life got complicated or hard that she can tell to our grandchildren.


1. My husband is returning to school full-time for the next 2-3 years to have a Kiwi DEGREE and qualification. I have been in contact with Australian Nurses Association who tell me that I will have to take a 6-8 week “refresher” course should I wish to return to and practise nursing in Australia.

2. WE are trying to have another child as I am now 40 and time is running out to give*** a sibling. New Zealand seems to be the only country I have lived in that actually “pays” you to have kids. Why not do it here?

3. Hubby will have to work a year in his field here in New Zealand after “completion” . At that time we will assess whether it will be better to return to the States or simply do what most professional Kiwi’s do and move to Australia. *** will be about 7 at that time. WE will have to determine her personality as well in determining where to go. It would be nice to stay in New Zealand a few more years (for her sake)-but it seems to be professional and financial “suicide”.

4. We will continue to stay close to our “friends”. We all live in Christchurch, some have kids, some don’t. Many of us happen to be Jewish but that only means we do not eat pork around the others (some are vegeatarians) -we go “camping” about three to four times a year together and often have a Saturday meal at my house. We all “care” about issues, but none of us are “fanatical” and most of us are giving this Kiwi thing “a go”-most happen to be Engineers and nurses but that is because of immigration policy’s. So, if you are “lonely”
(but not really) and think you might fit into the “group”-pop me an email and then come around to meet some people and see if our little group works for you. We just had the man from Seattle move to Australia this week, so we are looking for “a new cousin”.

Set a financial limit, (whatever that may be-often it is the price of a ticket home)-come, give it a go. You will always wonder what could have been had you not. Make friends with expats and other’s in this forum first, then worry about befriending Kiwi’s. Let them come to you. Give it a REAL go and then, if you hit the financial number you set, marry a Kiwi, have a kid, or go home. Sounds blunt, but that is our live in a nutshell.

Finances – I echo everyone’s sentiments – Save as much money as you can before you come. Everything’s expensive, with smaller selection and often of lesser quality. Weekend markets are great places to get produce and fruit, sometimes less than half of the supermarket prices. We brought a container, and loaded it w/ food from trader joe’s – only wish we’d brought more. I took someone else’s advice and also packed two year’s worth of clothes for our daughter.

Childcare – Actually cheaper here than in Seattle. And very good! At age three, the gov kicks in a subsidy. (Not clear on all the details, but I believe it’s a relatively new programme and quite generous.)

Sentiment toward Americans/Foreigners – Socially, we’ve felt very welcomed. Within the first few weeks of settling were invited to several neighbor’s homes and social gatherings. It could be the neighborhood, fairly old and v.international w/ many retired diplomats. Everyone at the park we frequent chats with each other.

Hope this was helpful. As our time progresses, I’m sure our experience will evolve.

404 thoughts on “We Chose To Go With New Zealand. BIG MISTAKE

  1. Thanks for the truthful yet informative article, it provided my family valuable insight to the kiwi’s new pilot scheme for singaporean.


  2. “There is a VERY VERY serious alcoholism problem in this country, not just drinking but “binge” drinking that you usually do not see until college in the States.”

    This is true. According to a new WHO study, Kiwis drink an average of 9.6 litres of pure alcohol each per year, well above the 6.1-litre global average! I have resolved to tape the drunken hoons howling and roaring past my door every Friday and Saturday night. The Ministry of Health’s epidemiology group found that 1 in 7 New Zealanders frank MORE THAN 6 standard drinks (men) and more than 4 standard drinks (women) per drinking occasion.

    I do not leave the house after a certain hour, and avoid going out at certain other times. You’re taking your life in your hands on these roads. The drivers are frightening enough during the day – at night, they are horrifying.


    • I’m New Zealand born and I lived in Australia for now 32 years, Australia also has a drinking culture, and so it is getting worse all over, the key here learn of now the european kids learn to respect alcohol from a young age it’s the western world that for some reason don’t know how to respect alcohol and abuse their bodies, violences, police called out and damage to property, no disciple at home & both parents are working, get back to basis care about your kids welfare and education, employment , having jobs when they finish school or completing university and the worse thing both countries did is got rid of military training bring it back in like Singapore, Israel, Pride, Respect, Honour, New skills, Leadership, Long lasting friendships, Purpose, and the last reason why that all those mentioned above you used in your family, work, sport, community and you can make a differences for others.


  3. This bloke is more positive about the No. 8 wire mentality. They have surely made good use of the Internet for marketing purposes, but actually living and having internet here is tortuous. Expensive and capped! Still! In 2011! I am trying to run an IT business from home here on a limited budget. I could just explode at all the limitations.


    “the big thing holding Kiwis back from their position on top of the online world is their crappy, crappy Internet service.

    The Internet is mostly capped, here. For those of you who don’t know what this means (I didn’t, until I heard about them trying to do it in the States and swiftly being rebuked) is that you generally don’t pay a flat fee for unlimited Internet each month. Instead, you pay for, say, 3 gigs of downloads per month, and once you use that up you either get moved to a DRAMATICALLY slower connection, or your net gets cut off completely (I, unfortunately, am faced with the latter plan).

    The pricing is even worse for mobile plans. It’s been a while since I’ve seen such a dearth of smartphones…it’s just too expensive, and the network too unreliable.

    It’s bad, people. Much worse than most of the 3rd world countries I’ve been to. And it’s a result of a competition-stopping duopoly and one old, crusty cable carrying packets of information along the ocean floor.”


  4. “That is how it is with expats…very few actually come here to stay even though they may THINK that they are at the time.”

    This is so hard, I agree. My best expat friends just up and leave town all the time. Most of them seem to leave the entire country. Going out and finding new friends is not easy. It does wear on you after awhile.


  5. Internet is excruciatingly slow and expensive down in New Zealand. I spent 2 years there.

    Read the article on gizmodo called How Bad Do We Really Have It Bandwidh Caps Around the World.

    For anyone who really enjoys the Internet as a primary source of communication, news and entertainment option, Kiwiland is hell.


    • I live in Palmerston North, where like much of NZ we now have fibre to the home. I get 102mb/s down and about 60 up, day and night – in fact until last week all our TV came over fibre. The original poster has a few valid points here, but to be honest having moved from Scotland she’s highlighting a lot of very stereotypical things about Americans abroad.


      • You’re replying to a comment that was made 4 years ago. In that time Palmerston North managed to get “fibre to the home”. Please can you share with our readers how much you pay for that service and whether you have a data cap, throttling etc? We note that you’re presently using the internet services of the Universal College of Learning.
        Thank you.

        Note to readers: The Government aims to roll out fibre-to-the-home connection in all main towns and cities with populations over 10,000. The programme aims to deliver ultra-fast broadband capable of at least 100 Mbit/s download and 50Mbit/s upload to 75% of New Zealanders by 2019. 1,340,000 households will eventually be connected. As of October 2014, 92% of internet connections have a fixed data cap. The most common cap is between 20-50GB per month. On average, each person uses 12GB of data per month. (Wikipedia).


        • There are unlimited plans for ufb that are somewhat reasonable [~$100/mo], [but more expensive than elsewhere]. Why did it take so long, lots of other places have had this years before. Only reason this happened was this was a government subsidized initiative. Embarrassment no doubt hastened this roll-out.
          Now, cell service, no fully unlimited plans [which are common elsewhere] last time I checked. Cell data is still capped on any plan available in NZ. Drag them into the 21st century [kicking and screaming].


          • It is a small country, it should have had fibre optics sorted out years ago.

            In the UK, BT offer 76 Mb unlimited internet, free evening and weekend calls, BT Sports Pack and 50gB of cloud storage all for £30 ($72 NZ). That seems like reasonably good value for money?


          • I’m pretty sure that I’d posted this info before, I was watching [US] tv online [super bowl or NBA finals] and caught some ads for cell service plans that were far ahead [unlimited calls, txt, and data] for aprox $60.
            I went to look to see what comparable plans [in nz] were. NZ has NO unlimited cell plans. So slow to adopt accepted standards.


  6. this article was so awesome to read. i come from an above average lifestyle so i see/have seen what’s on ‘both sides of the fence’. and i have grown up and lived in all parts.

    hey you should honestly move from christchurch as it is so over populated and unpredictable with the earthquakes. the north island has alot more to offer. especially waikato. with all the farms, meat works i don’t know why everyone hasn’t moved already.

    i worked at the meat works for a few months before i fell pregnant and was getting paid $14 per hour. which was pretty good as minimum wage used to be $9.50. so i was making around $600 per week. my partner has been working there since he was 15 years old and is now racking in more then $1000 per week for around 11hours per day 5days a week. we both started off with no qualifications.

    it did help that my siblings worked there when i started because they put in a good word for me.

    you are so right about winz, when me and my partner broke up i had to go on the benefit, i was getting paid $500 per week, it is great that they do this but there is no motivation to get you back to work at all. but they are still complaining about everyone on the DPB. alot of my freinds are on the DPB and it is hard to see them struggle with there kids just scrapping by each week but still having enough money to get a box and some smokes. i really blame it on the parents for not trying harder to get them out of the same cycle that they grew up in.

    i think also that it is awesome that teens can go to a doctors for free to get advise, be able to prescibe themselves condoms, birth control pills etc. at least they are thinking about that stuff. it is hard for a child/teen to talk to their parents about sex and things and they especially wouldn’t want to tell you, because of embarrassment and because they may feel like a dissappointment. i think the best thing we can do is keep kids informed about contraception and keeping safe.

    ORCON is the best by far for the internet.


  7. mizzykizzy, I was born in New Zealand and after 20 odd years of enduring people of your ilk decided to leave and never return.

    “i come from an above average lifestyle” =So that means you weren’t brought up in Otara but Panmure.

    “the north island has alot more to offer. especially waikato. with all the farms, meat works “ = These are both tertiary educated people and you want them to move to the Waikato to work in a abattoir slashing up dead carcasses all day for $14 an hour. Have you left your mind???

    “my partner has been working there since he was 15 years old and is now racking in more then $1000 per week for around 11hours per day 5days a week” = Fantastic, he got his career path sorted out when he was real young.

    “it did help that my siblings worked there when i started because they put in a good word for me. “ =This is the reason immigrants can’t get work because of the old boys network, who cares if others were harder working and more qualified.

    “you are so right about winz, when me and my partner broke up i had to go on the benefit, i was getting paid $500 per week, it is great that they do this but there is no motivation to get you back to work at all” = Yes, one of the reasons I left. I got sick and tired of being treated like a beast of burden.

    “alot of my freinds are on the DPB and it is hard to see them struggle with there kids just scrapping by each week but still having enough money to get a box (Beer) and some smokes.” = Don’t forget the family pack of dope.

    “i think also that it is awesome that teens can go to a doctors for free to get advise, be able to prescibe themselves condoms, birth control pills etc. at least they are thinking about that stuff. it is hard for a child/teen to talk to their parents about sex” =I believe the age of consent is 16 but the health services is encouraging 14 years olds to break the law, interesting concept.

    Mizzykizzy, I am so glad that you came on here and contributed so all potential immigrants can get a taste of a 100 % pure New Zealanders aptitude. You are fairly typical of the “average kiwi” that one can expect to meet when they arrive, especially when all the NZ Uni educated ones have left for Oz or EU or USA.


    • Jerry, if you haven’t lived in nz for 20 years and are someone who doesn’t seem to think much about NZ and NZers, why do you feel the need to spend so much time on the Internet slagging the place off. Not all the uni educated new zealanders leave, some do but I think you’ll find that most don’t.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Al, if you take the care to read Jerry’s interesting comments you’ll see that he lived in NZ for 20 years, not left 20 years ago. You paid it about as much attention as you do those speculative CVs.


  8. Nowhere is perfect. There are people everywhere that make life irritating or terrible. On the whole, I like the people of NZ, but the business practices and what passes for business ethics suck. There are little cliques and cartels everywhere and if you are not one of the boys, then you will get nowhere. In countries like the USA, the Occupy Movement complains about one percent of the population owning 1/3 of the assets. In NZ one percent own sixty – yes, that’s right 60 percent of the assets. And parliament entrenches this while the ordinary working man/woman just struggles to make ends meet. Prices of durable goods are THREE times higher than in places like OZ and the USA. And don’t tell me its about small markets – that is shite. This is about a handful of big boys controlling the distribution channels and rorting the system. This lack of opportunity combined with blatant exploitation is why one quarter of all Kiwis born in NZ will migrate permanently rather than stay here. This place is long overdue for a really bloody revolution that will end the exploitation that leads to over a quarter of a million kids living in poverty. Godzone, what a joke. We’re owned!

    Liked by 2 people

    • Why are the ordinary kiwis buying from this 1% that own 60% of NZ?
      Is it possible that they do not want to patronise people offering the same services and products for less, who do not share citizenship with them?

      I have been told that when Asian migrants set up restaurants, some Kiwis avoid it primarily because of the change in ownership, not what the menu offers.


      • P Ray it’s complicated as to why Kiwis let this 1% own 60% of the assets. Your best bet is to buy this book on Amazon that explains the concentration of wealth in Capitalist countries and look what it says about NZ. The phenomenon is worldwide, but just more pronounced here because it is an island nation. The book is a good adventure story with social and sociological commentary throughout called “Sniper Missions – The Business of War and the War of Business” by Sergeant Radar Erasmus. It will be the best $3.99 that you will ever spend and it will anger you when you realise just how we are all being conned.


        • I am sure that’s a good book, but all the Marxist arguments in the world cannot explain away the fact that New Zealand’s culture is a difficult one for immigrants to become a part of. It has a certain character to it for various reasons that transcends any political changes. We moved there in the Helen years and nothing much changed when Key took over except for the volume of the Marxist whingers’ complaints. Ever since people were first conned into moving there by snake oil salesmen in real estate Ponzi schemes, lies have been told about the “lifestyle” on offer, and leftie New Zealanders buy into the insane illusion as well. Read this junk. http://www1.internationalliving.com/sem/country/down-under/new-zealand/google/content/retire-lp.html?_kk=retire%20to%20new%20zealand&_kt=955f66eb-9a66-419b-b7b9-05641d5dcd8b&gclid=CKyry6K4rbsCFQbl7AodexAAUA


          • I looked at the book and it has some whopper lies, especially about the house prices in New Zealand and Australia. However, this is how the migration scam works.

            For retirees, New Zealand is actually a great place to spend several months during the summer in a place like Fiordland, but it is not a place to live permanently unless you fit into the inexplicable New Zealand mould. Nonetheless, I think you can replicate this style for much less in Latin America. New Zealand has Latin American incompetence and quality, but Switzerland or Norway prices.


    • 1964? That is commendable!

      Aren’t you lucky that you don’t have to emigrate and find work these days. Do you attribute your lack of compassion and inability to empathise to living in New Zealand for so long?


    • [Deleted because of repeated (passive aggressive) ad hom attacks and the inevitable ‘don’t like it, leave’ sign off.

      And you’re a teacher in NZ and wrote that rubbish during school hours when you should have been teaching? Way to go with setting an example!

      Please don’t troll. Unlike the classroom, this is a safe place. Maybe you need a change of career?

      You’re banned.


  9. She sounds exactly like a Kiwi. 1964 was another world. New Zealand has changed a great deal since then. And read about how it started trying to attract migrants by advertising, and only recently on this blog it was noted, doing things like removing anti-intellectualism from its Wiki entry to actively prevent people from finding out the downsides. The attitudes have not changed in New Zealand, but its marketing has. It is not easy to find out what New Zealand is really like without living there for awhile. If you can call that “living”. http://books.google.com/books?id=YnB2o3_UOTMC&pg=PA27&lpg=PA27&dq=%22new+zealand%27s+nation+branding%22&source=bl&ots=kPwQ_WmZoL&sig=1cBAcqxXakWH9aPAcL7AkS7RWSQ&hl=en&sa=X&ei=vFFRUvaQL4Ts8gSF_ICwAg&ved=0CCgQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=%22new%20zealand%27s%20nation%20branding%22&f=false


  10. well after 9 years here we are off back to the uk..had enough..the wifes a professional manager and has been threatened at work swore at and the people involved were just moved on by the company..not sacked!! I went back to being self employed as the wages here are pathectic ..and endured lying cheating kiwis ..something i never really experienced by my customers in the uk..hence i do not trust them at all! Friends are mostly english apart from one kiwi who is married to a scot lady..and even he said dont trust the kiwis.Wish i had never dragged my wife over here…only good thing is i have a kiwi passport.and ill use this one day to get in to Australia…ill never come back here.


    • I have an English colleague at work and he comes from Southport. He absolutely love it here. He said the only thing he misses about England is his friends, otherwise.. he said he loves the fresh air and not many people and the easy access to the beach and … he loves everything.


      • +Heather, “compromise” is a very big word and people get into that mode without complaining. British (in particular) are known to have some decency before complaining at the top of their voice, if it were a Kiwi in Britain kept in similar situation then you would see the difference. If your English colleague doesn’t acknowledge about stuff written on this site then chances are high that he’s baptized to becoming typical “kiwi” by now 😉


      • What people say to Kiwis and what they think in private are usually poles apart.

        Many migrants suppress their feelings about NZ. If the best your colleague can say about the country are platitudes about fresh air, few people and easy access to a beach (which they probably seldom use anyway) then something is wrong. They’re telling you what you want to hear.

        Come on, you previously said you’ve lived in Porirua for 25 years surely it has more going for it than that? Sense of community, great place to raise kids, comfortable warm homes, feeling safe…don’t these rate more highly than fresh air and beach access?

        That’s why sites like this one exist – to help people explore their feelings and misgivings about NZ so they realise they’re not alone in their feelings of unease.

        Heather, give your Southport friends the link to this site, try starting with https://e2nz.org/tag/migrant-tales, it sounds like they need us.


  11. Just moved back to Nz I’m a kiwi and the place is escalated backwards, a govt that is led by liars,cheats,and elitist attitudes, Nz is totally mis managed and going backwards financially, if there’s anything to own most assets are getting sold off as we speak.Wages are low,and yes it’s who you know as far as job opportunities go….I’m saving go go back to oz…I love this country but not enough to live in dire straits…………If you have the opportunity to live in oz…..Go there like the thousands of kiwis,each year..Sorry John Key, I’m out of here my tax dollars just aren’t worth staying for……

    Liked by 1 person

  12. Tony, did you read more than one sentence in the OP’s post?

    To her credit she didn’t take advantage of a system that was designed to allow people to bludge off it. You elect the politicians in your country and must bear some responsibility for the way your taxes are allocated.

    If she had a problem you’re part of it.

    Say hello to your colleagues at Chapman Tripp, Auckland from us.


    • It should not surprise us that someone from Chapman Tripp is trolling given their cosy relationship with the Kiwi government, especially with EQC.


  13. It sounds like you have moved to the South Island. If you do not have high paid jobs then yes it cold be a miserable experience. Many people in the South Island do not move and have no need to make new friends as their families are all close by. Yes rugby is a big talking point. however if you are prepared to follow the rugby and ask some of the locals around for a BBQ you will start to make friends. We have overseas trips every year and a beach holiday in Nelson in summer and winter skiing holidays. NZ is very self contained and you can do everything without going overseas.

    If you are still having trouble making friends then move to Wellington or Orewa where there are plenty of new immigrants. shalom.


    • Ben, you’re taking this piss right? Ten-dollar Tauranga is the worst advice ever. That town is so insular and “matey-matey” that they all find no problem with openly bragging about it. Winz denies benefits to Uni graduates and actively (or perhaps kindly) recommends that engineers move away ASAP, lest you end up picking kiwifruit for a psycho who insists you aren’t allowed to leave the property, even during off-hours, even if you live nearby. I am not exaggerating one bit. And sure, everyone is friendly until they settle into your trust enough to smoke P in your house and then steal your car. It truly is the worst place, full of the worst people I have ever experienced. The whole town is a friggin circus sideshow.


  14. Hi there,
    I loved your article about new Zealand. I live in Christchurch, too, in Heathcote. The local priest is American. There are vege Co-ops all over the city, usually operating from churches. There is a selection, already bagged for $10 every week. I go to Opawa baptist to collect mine on a Wednesday morning. My favourite things are walking, listening to music and reading. I’m kiwi born, but I love Americans. It would be nice to meet you both.


  15. The author said: New Zealand is the only coutry who pays for you to have chilcdren.
    That also applies to Canada. LOL. Each child below 18 years old gets an allowance from the government.


    • Same here Ben. Moved here (New Plymouth) with my family. Great job, great friends (90% are Kiwis) and totally settled. The Kiwis are very friendly and open to friendship but you have to make the effort. I think that most Kiwis are open to friendship to those who have tried to integrate in New Zealand, and most importantly work and contribute to the economy.
      I am an engineer which is in demand in Taranaki (oil & gas), hence why we moved here.
      Our family have lived and worked around the World and New Zealand, although is not perfect, is as close to perfect that we have experienced. Originally from the UK, the only thing we miss is family.
      My wife and I pinch ourselves with what we have in NZ compared to our lives in the UK, Spain and Switzerland.
      Any regrets?…..not even a single one.

      Liked by 2 people

        • You say in your other posts you moved to NZ in 06, therefor you would have arrived when the NZ dollar was not massively inflated and probably been able to buy property, which now is near impossible for most younger people in NZ. You also say your from Wales, but when asked, you tell people your from NZ ???? That’s a bit strange.

          The “less fake” comment made me chuckle, I have never met people as plastic and fake in my life than kiwis, or as yourself, a kiwi-wannabee, kiwis hide behind a brand, a silver fern for gods sake, it’s plastic, tacky and printed on everything in the country.

          NZ has no history, no culture or roots of its own, as I have said and heard so many times in the last few years, people in NZ moan about the UK, only to justify to themselves that they made the right choice with NZ.

          If you enjoy isolation, propaganda, hypocrites, Americanism, expensive living, inflated housing, over valued NZ dollar, poor housing, racism, 2 faced, backstabbing people your well suited my friend.

          None of the above matters though, because you can have a BBQ….

          Enjoy heaven


        • Less fake? You generally can’t believe a thing they say. The lack of honesty is rampant, and that is about as fake as you can get.
          How long have you been in NZ? That may have something to do with it.


        • There are people who do fit into New Zealand. Ben above sounds rough n ready and turning his hand to all kinds of mechanical things, so he would fit in well. The other one, well, an engineer in oil and gas, he has the income not to have to encounter the worst of society there and is in an area where his job would receive some respect. I think there was a thread on it over here – being frugal, loving rural areas and a little counterculture, I truly thought we would fit in, too. We did make friends, but the culture in general was too difficult. The economy was worst of all. It warped everything. The housing stock and drugs were just awful. The attitudes, well, you can sort through and find nice people. But when your home country is just all around a better place to live, sorting through people to find the good apples when you already have a large crowd of good apples at home is not worth it. Moving to New Zealand was a mistake for us, too. And a number of other people who never bother to post about their experience, but shared their views with us. New Zealand does have holes certain people will slot into well. Finding out whether you are one of those people and where that hole is, might just not be worth the cost and hassle of the move, though. That’s our point here.


      • Yet despite your state of bliss (and having lived in Switzerland which you say is preferable to NZ??) you somehow managed to find your way to this site? Please be advised we have a zero tolerance policy regarding trolling. Carry on drinking the Kool-Aid but don’t try to peddle it here.


        • I think some people become adept at practising intellectual gymnastics as the dampness, mould, and unbearable cold of the crappy New Zealand houses sets in. Admittedly, New Zealand is great for a certain type of person, usually those that are lazy, uncultured, and lacking ambition.

          Justifying one’s actions and the difficulty of admitting a mistake often provides a strong impetus for denying reality.


  16. It looks like the original post was from a few years ago so I’m hoping things have improved for her and her family. Unfortunately, there were some definite truths in what she posted but it may be a circumstance of geography. I do believe that it could be easier in a bigger population as far as job opportunities go especially now that the economy has improved. As a recruitment company owner, we often despair in finding talented people to fill jobs. There seems a real mismatch in skills required by employers and those on offer tend to be lowly skilled. We could blame the government but it’s hard to do too much when navigating through world economic instability. Now that books are looking better, I’m hoping whichever govt comes in this year focuses on getting our young people motivated and onto upskilling themselves in areas we have actual jobs. I also have trouble understanding why we lure skilled immigrants here and then make it so hard for them to find work. Again, I can only hope that now demand is greater than supply, that has changed.

    It’s a big call to uproot yourself from all you know and your support systems to come to a new country. I admire anyone who has the courage to do so and truly wish that all immigrants get a warm reception and settle into the wonderful life most of us experience.


    • Hi D,
      I’m not really sure whether I can help but presume you’ve spoken to specialist legal recruitment companies? There’s a couple in Auckland if you do a google search. The only other suggestion I have is to try and find a mentor within a law firm that practises within your area of specialty and ask for help to transition to the NZ environment. Perhaps through the legal associations you may get a referral? Go direct to well respected retired partners? It’s basically trying to access their networks. I’m assuming your quals are recognised here but if not, you may need to complete the equivalency exams.

      Don’t think I’ve been too helpful but wish you all the best.


      • MBF – I doubt that you will follow this up – now 18 months later. My experience is that employers in NZ actually “fear difference”. I have helped people with advanced degrees get work here (NZ M.Sc and Ph.Ds – not foreign ones). For the work on offer they were eminently qualified – perhaps over qualified – but obviously willing to work for the salary envisaged. In all (of 20) but one case they were rejected for various reasons. Now, some of those reasons would be genuine – but the majority, when I followed up, were specious and some downright fatuous!

        In other cases with highly qualified foreign people, hoping to emigrate – the effort required (to prove no NZ applicants were available or suitable), was just a bridge too far. Admittedly, this required three advertisements in local and other newspapers and posting the job in the local WINZ office. Soooooo exhausting.

        There is this pervading “fear” in many NZ employers – one that I do not understand and it is not because it is too difficult. Or perhaps that is really it – it IS too difficult – but only in the mind of the employer.

        My contention with the initial writer is that NZ professional qualifications (medical, dental, legal etc), are accepted readily overseas. I cannot comment on nursing, but would tend to agree about the level of engineering skill being on the low side, due in greater part to that inertia of most employers.


    • Kiwis fear someone that might be smarter/more quailified/being shown up or outdated. Sucess is something they have a love/hate relationship with [hence the tall poppy thing].
      Firms don’t want to hire someone that might have new/different skills [that they don’t possess], and they are affraid to seem small, not up with the latest [ironic as they can avail themselves of the newer info with hiring you], and they are happy with the way things are; slower, less efficient, poor quality…
      They want what they don’t have but are not willing to admit it, so they “harden up” and pretend that they don’t want/need what they really could have. It is rather bizzare.


      • This is SO true! I have told my friends back in the US that to your face everyone seems very friendly all the social welfare ‘everyone is equal’ stuff. But, you can see ‘deep down in’ that there is an issue due to lack of patriotism to where they live wanting to be someone else from somewhere else, but they aren’t. My move here, from the USA – with my 3 kids, I am second guessing, despite being married to a Kiwi,


  17. Everyone – a fellow unhappy migrant suggested that we leave some comments on the BBC’s Wanted Down Under Facebook page. They’re trying to persuade families to move from happy situations to NZ or Aus by taking them on a week’s glossy vacation there! As if.


  18. NZ has its problems but that isn’t stopping the hoards of immigrants desperate to come here. Why?

    Because if you compare living here to so many other places in the world, it’s actually quite fantastic. In saying that, it’s not for everyone, but that’s why you need to do your research first.

    If you like breathing fresh air, breathtaking scenery, finishing work at 5pm and heading to the beach while the suns still shining, roast lamb, horses grazing in residential areas, picnics, having a weekend that doesn’t involve going to the mall, good beer and wine (and cheap), sending your kids to schools where they can play and have an actual childhood, having a trampoline in your back yard, having a back yard and living in an actual house, owning a car when you’re 16, drinking tap water, having hens lay eggs in your yard, fishing, starting or owning a small business, DIYing it…then you might like it here.

    If you like international fashion, big shopping malls with cheap goods, great nightlife, heaps of people and events, plentiful, cheap and or exotic food and restaurants, modern buildings, high salaries, techy jobs, convenience stores, world renowned schools, plentiful career opportunities….then go elsewhere.

    Don’t buy a ticket to Antarctica and expect a tropical paradise, you get what you get. I’ve lived in both types of places and traveled the world – it has given me an appreciation for this country I never would’ve had. Do your research, get a job before you come or have a plan to get out before your funds run out. No place is fun when you’re on minimum wage, but I have to say if you are then NZ is actually a damn good place to live anyway, you will always have someone to look after you.

    NZ is a very young, very under populated country, yet people expect it to be at the same level as other western countries. We have a lot to offer, a lot of immigrants have found success and happiness in this country including several from my own family. The OP was valid but some the comments are just cruel and unfair. Welcome to anyone that wants to become a Kiwi, just come with a good attitude and try to keep it!

    Liked by 2 people

    • New Zealand promises a lot and has so little to offer. If you are a looking for escape from a war-torn existence in another land, sure, it’s a step up. But, honestly, New Zealand isn’t looking for immigrants who are suffering; the downtrodden poor need not apply.

      The people whom New Zealand is targeting are the talented migrants from better nations. And these immigrants find themselves marginalised and shut out despite their qualifications when they arrive, due to the deeply-ingrained ignorance, fear and incompetence which is rampant in kiwi society.

      So, the problem isn’t what immigrants expect, it’s what New Zealand pretends to be, contrasted with what it really is: a second world country in decline.


    • Yes, your comments about coming with a good attitude and ‘try to keep it’ is sage advice. The bitter cold (yes, even in the north island), grey days, and lack of anything to do outside for my kids when it is cold, rainy, and wet, has them in cabin fever land! Yes, I should have thought MORE about where I came from prior to coming to a place with limited opportunities to enjoy the outdoors, even if it more breath taking a view here, than the western US. Working in a job that I do not like to buy groceries and fruit/veg at Saturday markets so we can afford fruits and veg is crazy. Take heed professionals…. REALLY LOOK HARD at where you are coming before making the commitment, especially if you come from a large US metropolitan area. Living even in the capital city (Wellington) there is little to do. If you have teenagers, understand that there is NOTHING for them to do unless you have them in sports activities every day after school! No wonder they offer free birthcontrol without a parents consent at the age of 14. Everyone is on island time here. Do NOT expect that you will get things accomplished in the time frames you are used to in the US. Everyone goes on holiday 4x a year and is revolved around the substandard IMHO educational standards, as compared to the US. There are 3 2-week term breaks and then the 5 weeks at Christmas/summer. Everyone checks out a week before the breaks and takes about 2 weeks to get back into the swing of things. You do the math! 5weeks x 3 = 15 and 8 weeks at summer = 23 weeks of the year people are on holiday in their minds. That’s a wonderful state to be in as long as you plan on doing nothing. Look at the lack of motivation is a large segment of the population, is it any wonder? I have asked about homework in schools and the repeated pat answer is that the ‘new’ way and statistics show that homework does not improve someone. Instead they should be playing a sport after school (see my comments above about keeping your teen busy and in sports!). Well, my kids want to go back to the US for University and I am sorry they are not going to get to go there unless we return to the US post haste for their education. Here, an 85 = an A. Universities do not necessarily have text books, a university year is about 2/3 of the time spent in a US counterpart. Oh yes, and you get to resit for tests up to 3 times if you are get qualifications for particular training. Please, do yourself a favour and do ALL of your homework prior to bringing your family, especially kids whom you want educated here. Additionally, if you are someone who cannot stand the cold then do not come – or as others have mentioned, come with an inordinate amount of money to try and heat a home that the wind whistles through due to terrible prior building codes that many homes/apartments suffer from. We live in a beautiful home but cannot afford to heat it. We keep one room closed with a heater. In fact it is 13 Celcius (Yes, 55 degrees F) in my home now as a type looking out at a beautiful setting through the window but freezing in 3 layers and a winter jacket inside. Just be informed. Are there good things about NZ? Of course! Just MAKE sure you do your homework on the things that YOU hold as priority, thoroughly check your priorities out before making the final decision!! All the best with your decision making.


    • “If you like breathing fresh air”, except in the winter when everyone [who is lucky enough] is using woodburning stoves to heat, you can smell the wood smoke. ChCh has a ban on woodburners at times during the winter.
      Scenery is everywhere.
      Finishing work at 5 means stores are closed when you want to go to them.
      “sending your kids to schools where they can play and have an actual childhood” inclusive of being bullied and poorly educated [except in how to avoid “getting the bash”].
      “living in an actual house” that you can not afford to buy and is like a wind tunnel and cold and unaffordable to heat in the winter and uncomfortably warm in the summer [that indoor/outdoor flow?].

      So far, even the good points are not very good.


      • Much of that ‘scenery’ is because of New Zealand’s active geotechnics and its position on the Pacific Ring of Fire -Cantabrians know the effects of that only too well.


    • So much hate. Bye, don’t fall off that high horse on the way out.

      Please read our Comments page. There you’ll find out we have a zero tolerance policy regarding trolling and ad hom attacks.

      You’re now banned. For both.


      • Readers are reminded that bans are permanent.

        Sure it sucks to be thrown out, but E2NZ is not your mom.

        Maybe if people like “Kahmal” Kaikoura Dave had a better upbringing they’d not go on to be dysfunctional adults?


  19. I may be an unusual poster as I have been here since 1971 so am well used to NZ. I have a kiwi husband, children and grandchildren. I have a comfortable life having worked as a nurse here. Paid my taxes etc etc. so to an outsider it would appear I am settled and really a kiwi now. Well I cannot put in to words how much I loathe living here. There has never been a day that I didn’t wish I was home in UK. The culture of cynicism and greed are tiring . I am sick of the sullen lazy parts of the population. They are soft and incapable of coping with anything. The driving, the children, the general lowering of everything to the lowest common denominator. I hear every day how lucky we are to be here. I gave just returned from home and have decided that this is now my last chance to return for good. The family are all fine and settled and will visit. The grandchildren are growing fast and their OE will be a reality. My daughter loves England too so one day her and her husband may well move over as well. Looking at houses and feeling really good. I know I come from a great part if the Uk and it’s not all wonderful but it us where I want to live. Think carefully before you come to this soulless place. I have served my sentence over over 40 miserable years.


    • Your comment “the general lowering of everything to the lowest common denominator” really resonated with me. My grandparents generation at least had pride in themselves and their personal standards but the newer generations just don’t seem to, whatever is easiest whether it’s the language they use, clothes they wear, way they walk, aspirations they have. It’s so sad. We are in Oz now and it is very different, people have pride in themselves and have the expectation of success. I hope you do make it back home and enjoy your time their back in civilisation. I feel quite ashamed of a lot of the behaviour NZers exhibit. Yes there are some great Kiwis, but the overall passionless hostility must just be shocking to a lot of immigrants.


  20. I’m a New Zealander from birth, I went to the UK for 2 years on a working holiday visa and didn’t want to leave. All the above comments are true. NZ is safe and has an amazing outdoors, but that is it. Well written post and totally agree with you on all points.


  21. Interesting. Complaining because the support for mothers and families is so good. That’s a new one. 🙂 If a little country like NZ can do it, why not the US? As for “no incentive” to go out and work…..that comes down to the individual. As you said, you had a hard time finding a job at all. In that situation, without support, you’d likely not be able to afford any children at all. NZ made that possible.

    Liked by 1 person

  22. The OP was talking about a system that rewards people for being reliant on it rather than contributing to it. And you think having a controlling nanny-welfare state is a good thing? Maybe breeding programs are needed to swell NZ’s population because so many NZ’ers live abroad. Have you ever considered that supporting the welfare state was one reason they left?


  23. I’m a registered nurse and I came to NZ a year ago from OZ, relocated because got married after a couple of years of long term relationship.

    My frustrations:
    Took 6-7 months to have my NZ registration + annual practicing certificated processed. I was told that there was an earthquake in Wellington (Location of nursing council) and that’s why it delayed the whole process.

    When I’ve finally received my registration – incorrect spelling (name) on the registration certificate. I e-mail + called the council so many times: zero replies. Ended up sending an angry e-mail …got a reply immediately after.

    Had to send that registration certificate back to the council in order to get a newly updated, correct spelling certificate. Took…them 2.5 weeks to do it.

    Yes I know things are done real slow here, but isn’t this a bit too slow?

    So everything said during interview turned out to be…different, completely different. There isn’t a lot of support and it’s so understaffed here that I find I’m placing my career in danger with these unsafe practices. During work orientation, everything looks good in words – verbal and in written, but in reality it doesn’t seems to be as good as gold?

    Question: Is there a huge difference between the public sector and the private?

    I’m sorry to say this but I honestly do misses working in Australia, at least the nurses are being looked after. Used to think how much problems there is in OZ but now I feel NZ is seriously washing my profession down the drain…

    Apart from the “go back to your own country” sort of comments, any other suggestions? I like NZ, the pay is less but the views and scenery — Priceless. Yes it is expensive here compared to OZ (I’m serious), but the food qualities are actually very good and worth it’s price — we deserve a treat every now and then.

    People here are nice too but I’ve had a few issues… well lots of issues with the South African Caucasians. Maybe it’s just personality clashes but seems like only them I have issues with?

    Wished I had look at this thread earlier on, or even a year ago…

    Thanks for all the comments peeps!

    • FrustratedA


  24. I don’t have first hand info, but I’ve heard [from Brit nurse] that the private hospitals are much better to work for.
    The mix up thing, not too suprizing, and the excuses, have heard alot of them.
    People from SA? That is unusual. I’ve not had any problem with them, and get along well. Outside of a few Kiwis, SAs have been some of the easiest to get along with. Every American that I’ve seen here I’ve gotten along with, without saying, we know [what it could be like]. Just a glance or look, and you know they’ve seen it, too.


    • I found this to be true too. Even if they were in denial about how crap it was, you could see it on their faces. Not wanting to offend Kiwis or lose their jobs, the lips would mouth careful qualifiers, but you could see it in their eyes. I wish more of these would be more honest. Fewer Americans would get “caught out” by the BS PR.


  25. I am a NZ’er and have lived in Australia for 10 years, trained as an EEN had a great job in a huge hospital. All our children got trained in trades and set. Unfortunately one of children finished school within the special needs area and we had to return to NZ as Australia wouldn’t support, Been back 6 years, my adult child is catered for but I am so frustrated with my own country. For a start as a enrolled nurse, you can only work in aged care and you are not appreciated. As for the amount of people on benefits, and the cost of living, this country is not that clean green nice place it once was when I was a kid. I now know why we went to Australia, to get out of the poverty. Stuck in my own country and it sucks!!!!!!!!!!!!


  26. Been here 24 years,from the UK married with 3 boys. 1 see the beauty of this country,but 1 long for home so much. please feel free to email me.


    • You should tell us more John, I have a friend in west auckland who is in a very similar situation, he can’t leave as he is married to a kiwi (a proper one, not a expat who has abandoned their identity) with 2 kids, both kiwi.

      He hates the place and has been there a few years 20+ so has property and lives a fairly decent life, but feels stuck and isolated.


      • I’m in the same boat too, I’ve been here 25 years and hate it more and more every day. The problem is my wife has a job she loves and chooses to keep drinking the Kool-Aid in regards to everything else. I went home for 2 years during 2012/2013 out of desperation but came back for my kids and tried to work on the relationship. I’m back to square one, hating the place with a passion but feeling trapped…


        • you guys talk as boats, for me is the whole dam cargo ship!
          my family came here in the mid 60’s when I was 4 going on 5. Ive been backwards and forwards many times, keep returning due to family. But my dad’s gone, my mother’s not far away, and once they are no longer around I’m out of here. Luckily my partner, born and bred kiwi girl feels the same way. She has a UK passport due to her father being ex UK, so once we sort things out we’re selling up and moving back to France….assuming the brits don’t brexit…. just when we had plans in hand someone has to go and throw the spanner in the proverbial works!


          • You’ll know by now that we voted to leave the EU.I’ve had a second home in northern France for 13 years and the French people I know are cool with that.A lot would like to do the same.Come to France by all means but do not underestimate the difficulty of getting a job.Even if you speak fluent French it will be a near impossibility.There are a lot of French people unemployed and,quite rightly,they will come first in the queue.If you’re going back to France to retire,enjoy the lifestyle-good luck!


          • Hi, don’t know if u have moved back to France yet, but big piece of advice is don’t. We endured 20+ years in France, paying massive taxes (ok, let me be super honest here – heart attack level taxes as we had French businesses). In the end, my family and I decided that we couldn’t take it any more. Every month prices hike up and up, the government invents new and even more punishing taxes that make no sense except to cripple a country that is already seriously struggling, and the outlook is extremely bleak. The quality of our family life was borderline poverty even when we were earning good money. Everyone in France exists on their credit cards, and this fake life is going to collapse any time soon. All the years we struggled and sacrificed and suffered horrendous racial attacks only to end up owing money made us rethink, and thank God we had the courage to relocate and start all over again. My Kiwi wife was seriously looking at us moving to NZ, but after doing loads of research and visiting sites like this and many others where people have the opportunity to unburden themselves and tell it like it is (for them at any rate), she thankfully decided that “going home” was not a good idea. More than 30 years away, and sentimental memories of a fabulous childhood growing up in the Bay of Plenty had, as she herself says, slightly warped her attitude about NZ. We have both found everyones’ perspectives extremely helpful, so many thanks to all of you that have contributed. We moved late last year to my home country of Bulgaria, (which has, in my 2 decades of absence, hauled itself up by its underpants into the 21st century). I still spend a great deal of time in France with my new international, non French company, and so, get to constantly reconfirm my wise decision in relocating. For the first time in years, I now am enjoying life. I have a very good income from my hard work and – how innovative – a reasonable level of taxes that don’t push me to the edge of insanity. Terrorism is tearing away at the very fabric of French Society (the 14th of July attack last year that killed 85 on the Promenade des Anglais in Nice happened only 100 metres from our old apartment where we used to live when we first married), and things will never be the same again. The Brexit vote hasn’t had time to affect any ex pats living in France yet, but it will. And taxpayers money being used to build thousands of new homes to house Syrian refugees is not sitting well with Monsieur and Madame average. Rebellion can be smelled in the air. Anyhow, my family now lives like royalty in BG on less than a quarter of what our old meagre life used to cost us in France. There are plenty of wonderful countries to live in in Europe (or anywhere else for that matter) so, do yourself a favour, if you are a smart bloke, give France the widest berth possible. It is not what it used to be.

            Liked by 1 person

  27. ..i have 2 kids,my boy was 7 yrs old and my girl is 9 yrs..were been here 6 months already…once in a while my 2 kids are saying that they wanted to go back to our country (philippines)..my hearth was melting and broken..but i dont know what to do..we dont have money to buy ticket..im sorry for my poor english..i dont have work but my husband has work..my husband has no idea about this…i dont know if i can say its homesick..its been 6 month were been here..well even me i really really want to go back to the philippines and i cant imagine that we can stay here for long..it so hard to stay here in new zealand..too much expensive to live here specialy if you dont have work..i was trying to find a job but i always failed..i miss my family,and also my kids,they miss thier cousin and playmates..can you please give me some advice?


    • @Ghie – You sound like you’re trying to stay strong and positive for your kids – don’t let your situation get you down as there are people who both care and understand. I can’t really give you any advice because I don’t know what situation you left, but do post your experiences here as there are many of us far from home and just voicing your problems can help.

      This may be of use – and In case this link doesn’t work, just google it – Filipinos Association in New Zealand – and you will at least be able to network a bit with people from home. Best of luck and welcome to this group.



    • It is a dangerous trap that is easy to fall into in this country: becoming unemployed, and you want to resume working as fast as possible (duh). I would suggest you go to a free, public sector career counselor who might be able to guide you. Their website is careers.govt.nz. Their contact links are on the right: be specific and ask to meet with a career counselor for free. I know they are funded by the government, but they are not the same as WINZ. From what I know of them, they tend to focus on entry-level jobs and general vocational counseling, so that may or may not suit. Have a resume/CV ready when you meet and be honest but not needy. Don’t expect too much but make them believe you are professional and ready to work, and they might know someone/somewhere that is hiring or might help. Catholic Social Services offers a low-cost counseling service, and they might be of some assistance also.

      I have met many Filipinos over the years and my impression is that most are struggling like many other migrants. In general, you probably have two choices:

      #1. Cut your losses as fast as possible. Sell everything, work day jobs or other temp work if you can, and save until you have enough money to return home as soon as possible;

      #2. Keep trying. Find a job or relocate to find work elsewhere in NZ. Christchurch has the lowest unemployment at 1.6% and could be your ticket, although the rental situation is very bad, and I personally would not want to live there.

      If you choose #2, you may find that your circumstances change if you become employed and you are able to make friends. Your kids might also find friends in a new community. Frankly, I wouldn’t be too hopeful, but at least keep an open heart, with a shield and sword nearby. Then after five years of saving, you can decide whether to apply for citizenship and/or relocate elsewhere in NZ, overseas, or back home. The point is that you will have made an investment in New Zealand, and you should use it to your advantage, and keep the option open for return in the future.

      I would recommend that you network with the Filipino community in your area to get help. If you are in one of the three larger cities, there should be other expats who can give you advice more relevant to your circumstances. I know there was/is an annual gathering every year at Mt. Taranaki of Filipinos in New Zealand that might be worth going to as well (that’s all I know about it). Try meetup.com for groups in your area that you might fit with; unfortunately there aren’t any Filipino groups on Meetup in New Zealand (there are at least two in Oz). There is also an organisation called InterNations that has meet-ups around New Zealand. Their website is http://www.internations.org/new-zealand-expats . When you go to any meet-up, don’t appear or act needy, just look for friendly people you feel comfortable with; let people know what you are good at; and see if they can suggest real solutions.

      Whatever you do, keep your eyes open and guard up to stay far away from the bottom feeders who seek to exploit people who are desperate (payday loans or shady immigration agents, for example). I would also avoid government aid (WINZ, etc.), as they are not only no help and generally a waste of time, they might actually cause you distress and will then have a file on you.

      Good luck.


    • @Ghie, i think this time you become adjusted to NZ life and you are already working.
      I noticed your comments here because I’m trying to apply and move if i am qualified.
      As of now i am working here in Middle East- Abu Dhabi,UAE. Living in a foreign countries needs us to adapt/love their culture and work hard.
      Also,Is there anyone can help me where i can seek an advice?


  28. Hello Ghie, try to make the best of it, try to find an occupation that keeps you busy during day time, doesn’t have to be a payed one if you don’t succeed in finding a job. Just keep yourself a bit busy so you have less time to think asbout the life you had before NZ. Try to find other people from the Phillipines say you can speak some easy language to other people apart from your familiy as well. Orcon has $13 per month calling internationally up unto an hour, if you want to continue the phone call, just hang up before 60 minutes and call again. If you really think you are not going to become happy in this country, make plans to go back. Your husband and children will be better of with a happy wife and mother.


  29. While on my PC/iPad sending invoices and quotes, i sometimes have 10/20 minutes looking at football, world news and a few various forums.

    One of those forums is a well known expat forum, it seems the message is finally getting through. Posted on 8th October 2014

    These are not my words

    I’m with ****, STAY IN KENT !!!
    Pretty much everything here is overpriced, this coupled with low wages and high property prices can result in a pretty miserable existence. Sure you can have a great view and walk on any one of a thousand beautiful beaches but after a while you realise that this country is mind numbingly dull.
    You’ll find the people very friendly and find it nice that total strangers look you in the eye and say good morning. After a while you’ll realise that this is actually very superficial, in reality the locals won’t like you very much and will resent your wealth, knowledge and experience. They all feel threatened by non kiwi’s, have a ridiculously inflated view of their country’s role on the world stage, are unbelievably ignorant, can’t drive but think they can and love to drink drive, drink hunt, and drink boat.
    You’ll be told about the ‘world famous’ kiwi ingenuity, this is what the rest of the world call COMMON SENSE!
    You may experience the ‘tall poppy’ syndrome, if you start to do well someone will do their best to ‘cut you down to size’.
    Your neighbours will love to pick up the phone to the council for any infringement you may unwittingly make, kiwi’s can’t do confrontation and prefer the cowards way.
    The media here is a joke, get sky for news other than the price of milk.
    Beware of the gangs, they are plentiful,cross them at your peril !
    Beware of bad motorists with no insurance, its optional here.
    If you buy a house to renovate you’ll probably have a stroke the first time you buy any building materials so be careful !
    If you have a dog and are looking forward to walking around clean green NZ with it forget it, they’re banned from the vast majority of the nice bits.
    Schools are NOT free you will be pressured to ‘donate’ on a regular basis.
    Make sure you and your children have perfect teeth, dentists here are thieves.
    Emergency services rely heavily on amateur volunteers with varying degrees of ability, don’t have a house fire or heart attack when the all blacks are playing you’ll have a long wait !
    Every visit to your GP will cost you, around $50 is not unusual.
    Feel free to ignore all of the above, just remember what I’ve written when the ‘honeymoon’ period is over. I’ve been here nearly 8 years and am getting out next year. Can’t wait!!


    • It’s ok you can say what the forum is 🙂 Thanks, that’ll be added to the migrants tales series. Those types of posts are generally not well received on emigration pimp sites so it is not surprising that the first person to respond to it was a moderator. This is how the NZ emigration sites are kept ‘on message’:

      Whilst we are all entitled to have a right old moan and a bit of a rant , it is not OK at all to pop up into a conversation , particularly one started by a newbie, with the thought to deliberately alarm and frighten.

      Having said that, to make that move across the entire world with hopes and dreams , only to find disillusionment is not something to be ignored because that could happen to anyone for oh so many reasons.

      We none of us walk in each other’s shoes after all.

      OP of this thread. Please take on board what I have written.

      I note you have made some rather large sweeping & uncomplimentary statements . That’s OK, although open to challenges, as it expresses your own personal feelings about your move to NZ. However, I want it noted that this is just your view and not necessarily the truth for anyone else.

      Ever noticed how many pro-emigration comments DON’T receive the same response and why should this type of post attract the attentions of a senior moderator anyway. The propaganda force is strong in NZ, too many ‘campagin posters.


      • The link is here if anyone wishes to view the full thread.


        As you can see I have contributed to the thread, not trolled, I have been polite and respectful to other posters, however it does really piss me off how the true life in NZ is hidden behind a wave of honeymoon expats, kiwi wannabes and propaganda.

        As you can see the moderator on the linked thread has urged people to move on from the negatives and let the thread slide, and only hours later another poster has popped up, talking about how unsettled they are.

        I will say so myself, and got a thumbs up for this comment but feel is sums up what expats do who post on said forums

        I occasionally drop onto this forum, sometimes post, but it is amazing how little of the truth gets through and its funny how the negative is sugarcoated with tales of empty beaches and
        Barbecues with people you don’t like, have little in common with but have round for tea because that’s what happy people do.

        Carry on slating the UK if it helps ease the overpriced isolation”

        People spend £thousands£ to get out there, move their whole life, using poor advice found on said forums, bents truths.

        I don’t wish to discourage anybody from moving anywhere, but please do not dismiss the negatives you see popping up on the net regarding NZ, do your research and do it well.


        • It’s a fact of life that emigration fora are NOT the best places to either give or ask for unbiased advice about New Zealand. You only have to look at the ads to see why they’re there and how they’re funded.

          On sites such as those the ‘happy clappy’ stories are allowed to proliferate, whereas negative ones are immediately focused on by moderators, even though no site rules have been breached.

          At best – the moderators are fulfilling their task of keeping their board on message. At worst – they view every downbeat comment as an attempt at subversive trolling. Is that simply paranoia? perhaps, but a better developed sense of perspective and a lighter touch is needed. They should ask themselves – “Who’s need am I servicing?” Who wants to risk posting something negative if it means the big guns will come after them?

          The overall effect of these moderation styles is to provide a very biased and inaccurate representation of life in New Zealand, by discouraging negative posts and allowing positive ones to flourish. It’s a process of elimination.

          It has been happening for years on NZ emigration forums (with the sole exception of UK2NZ.co.uk). Their censorship gave rise to major sites like Expatexposed.com and E2NZ.org, and a host of other spin-offs.

          It would be fairer if moderators of NZ emigration sites took a step back and only involved themselves when posts breach specific site rules.

          Their actions should be discrete and their comments made in private with the supposed offender.

          That doesn’t happen. Why not?

          That they should make such detailed deliberations in public could be seen as thought policing: i.e. subtle pro-NZ propaganda that insidiously infiltrates thought processes in the most remote country on earth (“I’m telling you what I think, so you know what to think”).

          Most New Zealanders aren’t even aware they’re doing it.

          We call it The Kiwi Effect. That dynamic appears throughout NZ society.


          • All five of your comments were published which is why people replied to them and you’re seeing their comments in your feed.

            However, this latest comment from you breaches our comments guidelines (no ad hominem attacks, no ‘like it or leave’ comments). We have a zero tolerance policy regarding trolling, therefore your profile has been marked disruptor and your posting ability has been rescinded.

            Perhaps you need to remind yourself which name you post under? Your previous comments:

            Goodbye, you won’t be missed. Keep sharing the Kool-Aid. It won’t raise your IQ any but it will make it a lot easier to live there.

            NB. In accordance with our zero tolerance trolling policy all of your comments will be removed in due course. Pass on our regards to Kaikoura Dave, his influence has been detected in your ‘work’ – some big words there buddy ;).


          • I am sure that some who have come here have been able to “make it”, yet why are all of the Kiwis that have left and come back making comments on here that echo much of what migrants are saying? Why are Kiwis on here lamenting what has happened to NZ?
            I’d ask you to site your source for your statement “I think you’ll find the majority of ex pats are happy here, I should know because I live in the ex pat community, it seems that most of you don’t.” I doubt that that is true and where is this “ex-pat community” that you speak of? Some special enclave? Maybe they’ve got it better in this “ex-pat community” that you mentioned.

            “Goodbye, you won’t be missed.” Seconded.


          • It’s sad. People migrate all the way to New Zealand and then gravitate together in an “ex-pat community.”

            Are the locals that anti-social or is there safety in numbers? Their failure to integrate speaks volumes about their “happiness”

            Most will eventually leave New Zealand because all is takes is for one of their number to break ranks – the others will then follow suit.


          • @admin “Are the locals that anti-social”

            I have an american friend whose kiwi workmates all go out for dinner once a month – except for her because “it’s for kiwis only”.


          • So petty, surely everyone should be considered a Kiwi after migrating to the country?

            Everyone in NZ is either a migrant, or descended from one.


          • That is disgusting, discriminatory and probably illegal. I am a kiwi-born and bred and this site makes me sad because a lot of it is fairly accurate. I hate to think of my fellow kiwi’s being so horrid. If there was a way to give you all my number safely I would do it and I bet when we met up I could show you that we are not all like that.


          • We are moving to christchurch next year as my husband has had a job offer as an embalmer. We will be bringing our 16 yr old daughter. I am hoping to get a job when we get there. My husband will be going in february and we will follow in july so he will be looking for a house. We are not planning on bringing our furniture. I was very positive about it all. I hope we are making the right desicion


          • I don’t know where you and your family are from or why you want to relocate to NZ but my advice to you would be no, please look into it closely before you relocate – kiwis promote the “best place for children” line but it is a cesspool of a place in social terms. Your daughter won’t be even remotely considered a child – they let their kids run wild from 14 or so – even the “best” schools have parties where the kids literally drink themselves to death. Google “roastbusters” and have a big long discussion with your husband before making the mistake so many of us already have. Best of luck! Go there for a holiday instead, have a look around. Don’t be fooled a holiday and living somewhere are the same thing. This place is horrible on so many levels – you really have to live it to understand it.


          • I wholeheartedly agree. New Zealand has ruined my life at the moment. I managed to escape the cesspool, but the effects of being in Retardicon 6 linger. If you want adventure or to change your life for the better, then you could find other places with better people and opportunities to call home. Avoid New Zealand like the plague.


          • Hi Anonymous, If you and your family live somewhere you are in danger then NZ would be a better option, otherwise I wouldn’t recommend a move here, try a local move first. There is a reasonably high possibility you will regret a move to NZ later on. We have lived here for 8 years, worked our nuts off for all we have and been despised for it. Looking back it hasn’t been worth the toll it has taken on us. Read this blog site carefully because sadly I recognise everything that is written here. There are some extreme posts but generally what you will read rings true. We have been trying to get out for the last three years and finally have managed to get to the point of booking one way tickets for January. We will never return.


          • Don’t do this to your daughter. You might be able to make a living for yourselves, but you will subject that poor girl to negativity she should not be exposed to in these crucial years. At her age, you should be preparing her to mature successfully into a happy, healthy adult. Instead, you will be submersing her into a hateful, spiteful, malevolent society, where the majority will want nothing more than to devalue and hold her back. If you must come here, maybe you can arrange for her to stay with friends or family until she graduates and, hopefully, attends college. If you and your husband still decide to come here and are very happy and successful after a minimum of three years, then and only then ask her to join you if she wants. I’d say the odds are very high you won’t.


          • Hi E2NZ, maybe you could create an area on the site called the “Troll Den” where you can move the troll comments you like best for all to see. I’m certain you get quite a few doozies each and every day. I would actually like to engage some lower life forms from time to time to stay sharp, and to practice some new moves I can use in my day-to-day encounters here.


          • We have a troll zoo. It’s at http://trollsnzandkoolaid.wordpress.com. It’s only opened up when trolls turn OCD and have a long history of offending. Thus far it has contained posts from Kaikoura Dave and his alts. Be advised Aiden was from r/newzealand and is active on Facebook, Whale Oil etc. Usually our policy is to deny trolls the oxygen of publicity.


          • I live in a nice house too, Charlie. It costs way more than it should, and for the same amount of money, I could have three times the home in a real city, in a real country, where the majority of people are interesting and have more to do than get boozed, stoned and connive. You go right ahead and enjoy yourself, mate. Maybe we’ll cross paths some day soon. I’m sure I’ll recognize you when I do.


  30. I find your comments very interesting. One thing is that I found your kiwi experience very similar to my US experience. The other thing is you seem to contridect yourself many times..Also you condemn our education. I found the average American to be pretty thick. Your grammar reflects this. Sorry, but these were the thoughts thats crossed my mind during a very interesting read. I never realised how much us Kiwis were neglecting our overseas residents. Will certainly make more effort. Thank you. Ned the Kiwi


      • Ned’s Kiwi education is evident in his spelling errors.

        @Ned – what experiences in the US did you find similar to those described here?


    • @Ned

      Thanks for leaving the USA and returning to New Zealand; your departure helped improve the aggregate IQ in the US a bit. Would you mind encouraging other kiwis who are like yourself to leave America as well?

      By the way, your writing skills are nothing to brag about, so you appear to be “contridect”-ing what you are trying to say.


      • Calvin, do you mean, ‘improve the average IQ’? Ned’s departure could have conceivably, reduced the ‘aggregate American IQ’, although I doubt if the concept has any meaning.


        • No, I think “aggregate” was a proper and correct choice – as in total or cumulative IQ.

          Let me make this simple. if I have ten numbers as follows:

          145, 125, -62, 135, 120, 117, -115, 106, 111, 109

          the cumulative total or aggregate amount is simply the sum of those numbers, which is 791.

          Now, if we take away – or remove – the number (-62) from the collection, the total or aggregate actually increases from 791 to 853.

          Of course, the average would also increase from 79.1 to 94.8, but I wanted to avoid making it too complicated, as aggregation requires addition only, and average requires addition AND division.

          See how that worked?


          • Well, it obviously works arithmetically, which isn’t the point, the question was, does the concept have any real significance? For example, the aggregate IQ of Classical Athens was far less than that of contemporary Persia,
            BTW, the best example of the ‘average IQ’ insult is the NZ PM Muldoon’s comment on Trans-Tasman migration.

            I’ve sometimes suspected that some people have negative IQs, but in reality, zero is probably the lower limit.

            I should let you get back to the topic on this thread.


      • Yes, please take any expat kiwis back to New Zealand with you, so they will stop telling us Americans how great NZ is and return to Live their Bluddy Dream in their own rotten country. Oh, and leave all the money you made in the U.S. back in the U.S. Give it to a charity or something. Clearly Yanks are thick, because all they do is make more money than Kiwis do. Maybe it is just their hard work and careful planning? Americans do have less “cunning” than Kiwis do, it is very true. I wouldn’t call that quality “smarts”. It’s just that Americans don’t have to always be crafting sneaky ways to get things. So we don’t always exercise that muscle – if we have it at all.


        • The “cunning” part is very true.
          In the States, cunning was not a “gotta have”, you COULD make it on merit alone, wasn’t as easy, but could be done. Honesty is valued.
          In NZ, “cunning” [lie. cheat, steal, shove your integrity in your sock…] is ABSOLUTLY REQUIRED, or you’ll never make it. I think that this is a way of having “cunning” become a normative trait. Honesty is a liability.


          • @carpentaro
            “Liability” is an understatement: honesty is a personality weakness and character flaw in New Zealand, and is effectively marking yourself for slaughter. You may strive to be a decent person, but to a kiwi, you’re a chump.

            Kiwis are hard-wired that way. Many Americans are more innovative and adaptable than flightless birds and can implement it in software, but the end result will be much more effective.

            I struggled with this for many years but in the end, it came down to basic survival and, eventually, success. Cling to false sentimentality and misguided notions of what is for the common good, and you will be roadkill. Think, train and act like the bald eagle.


          • It really is a liability. If nothing else, they will know that if they try to use anything you have said against you, that it won’t be b.s. Your word has value like something they might steal from your house. Because you tell the truth (perhaps in a misplaced desire to communicate efficiently), you have just given them money or gold in a country where dirt on other people is currency and dissembling is a national art.


          • This is not to say that one should be deliberately “dishonest,” but that information exchange must be purposeful, measured and carefully executed. Kiwi professionals, officials, and every day people are not accountable for what they say (or do). As long as they can provide a truthful-sounding explanation later, no harm will come to them; their culture will protect them. If you are wearing a Google Glass and were to record all your interactions, no one would hold them accountable, except for the most lurid or heinous conduct, and even then the punishment would be tepid.


          • This is true. And no one is saying “lie”. Just “consider the value of what you say in a future or other context that turns negative”. I find, you know, when I try to explain why I found their society such an awful place to live, that describing features such as this gets me nowhere with people who have not lived there. Cunning and lack of accountability are the NORM there. Sometimes it is active and sometimes passive (desire to avoid conflict). Among people of almost all classes and backgrounds (but not age, so much). Not characteristics of a subset of people, as in the States, but rather something you’ll encounter in many, many people. But try to explain some of this to some earnest dope who believes the advertising and wants to move there, and has been posting on forums and had the bought-off clappies on there urging him on, and has “future victim of Kiwis” written all over his face.


  31. Hi i am a civil engineer with 10 years experience in india..Cant even find a single job since i came here..Lost all money,.,,currenlty student….its 2014 and lot of work in christchurch.Construction companies here are too scared to hire someone. I have been calling, walk in, distributing cvs, applying thousand jobs online..no replies. Its the worst decision of my life to come here…spend 20 lacs in education to hear nothing from employers.


  32. “Trust adults” in NZ? More than in the States? No. Don’t let her trust adults in NZ. Trust ME – we got that t-shirt and I knew a few others who did, too.


  33. I am just curious if you will share which agencies troll your website the most. I suspect that the New Zealand government monitors this website and is responsible for some of the trolling. The NZ government agency that I once worked for had a “Ministry of Propaganda”, which spent time trying to manipulate online discourse.

    This might be a story worth sharing about the appalling childcare in Retardicon 6.



  34. I have a Migrant’s Tail that I would like to post, if possible. I have been coming to this site for a while now, and the comments I have seen have helped. Thank you for setting up this website.

    UK Scientist’s 12-year Grapple with New Zealand

    The positives: I like the outdoor opportunities in New Zealand and the country itself. I love the situation of our house in terms of the space we have, and we are happy with our lives. We got lucky with the quality of our home (although we are technically minded, and were very aware of the pitfalls).

    We are two self-sufficient people in our early 40s with a healthy lifestyle, we communicate easily with the outside world via the internet, and we download our video and written entertainment from international sources. We buy online from both local and overseas stores. Amazon and eBay save us thousands of NZD every year vs. the locally-sold, brand-named stuff.

    We live in one of the big city regions.

    Sounds good? Mostly positive, I agree. However, my personal opinion in regard to New Zealand society is overwhelmingly negative, and a real bummer.

    I know there are a large number of exceptional, socially responsible and intelligent people living in New Zealand. But this fraction of society is small relative to the other countries where we have lived (UK and Australia).

    I am a PhD educated scientist with overseas research fellowship and commercial consultancy-level experience here in New Zealand. My work used to cover research-based chemistry. I have authored well over thirty original research papers in most of the journals of my field.

    Since moving to NZ, all of that has become meaningless.

    The New Zealand economy is mostly based on the export of basic commodities and tourism-based dollars. There is no real work for research chemists unless you can find low paid work for the main production industries, i.e., the polluters: New Zealand agriculture, oil and gas. These industries usually only want qualified engineers, and not scientists, as there is very little active research happening in New Zealand itself. The chemistry research sector is tiny and is not adequately funded, or indeed, even promoted by the government. The current government is focused on downsizing almost everything and appears to be selling off or spitting up the less ‘productive’ crown research institutions. It is now forcing research work to be derived from commercial funding sources that have fixed commercial outcomes in mind. On a per-capita basis, government funding for general research is simply miniscule relative to Australia, or the UK, as examples.

    Unfortunately, a slow degradation of my career, which was hardly noticeable at first, has occurred. I started as a senior scientist at a non-governmental organisation, and I simply did not like it. The research funding was limited and the management was very poor at that time. I have had a consultancy-style job since then in New Zealand, but it was all about low quality commercial output and back stabbing your colleagues for pennies. I hated it, and got out.

    So, I was jumping around for a while trying to change direction, and this always looks bad on your resume. The economic downturn arrived and the relatively well-paid science jobs simply disappeared. At this time I was in the middle of a ‘career-changing’, non-chemistry-based masters degree at the time. This was bad planning, or I was simply unlucky.

    The only job I can get here in New Zealand now is as a semi-skilled worker. I have been doing this for three years now. Unfortunately, once you take a job like this, you are screwed, because any employer will wonder why the hell you did it. I did it out of desperation.

    My employer told me that this job does not require a degree, although I am actually managing the supply of technical materials to three departments for NZD110 take-home per working day. There is now only one other person here who has the skills to repeat my work. My wages have not increased with the ongoing rate of inflation.

    I am lowest paid employee in the entire division by at least NZD10k per annum (I know because people complain to me about their rate of pay). Everyone in the Science Division is a multi-generation New Zealander (with the exception of that first-generation New Zealander who can do chemistry at my skill level). We have had many scientists who have simply arrived, stayed for a year or so, and left the country (typically European).

    Regardless, I consider myself lucky to have this job. There are no other opportunities close to our location (I am constantly looking – every day). But even then, it would be a big risk because of our mortgage to leave this current position (which is stable).

    The worst part of the whole debacle is that I now commute by road for 1.5-2.0 hours every working day. There is no direct public transport route from our suburban home to this urban-commercial location.

    Why has this commute had such a negative impact on me? The behaviour of the average New Zealander on the road is simply awful. On a per capita, per hundred car basis, when we stepped off that plane in 2003, we became twice as likely to die in a motor vehicle accident as when living back in the UK [OECD stats]

    Usually, the true attitudes of individuals towards society are not actually expressed as behaviours because social norms, eye contact, etc., will moderate embarrassing, self-centred behaviour. When placed within a motor vehicle, however, these barriers are reduced and the behaviours of individuals tend to more accurately reflect their internal attitudes towards the people around them.

    After 12 years of driving on the roads in New Zealand I truly believe that most (not all) New Zealanders hate each other. If you are not within their immediate circle, i.e., in their car, you are hated. This type of New Zealander doesn’t just hate people from the USA, they hate everyone.

    These people appear to take out their daily frustrations by making others feel physically endangered. Tailgating is one example that appears to be an accepted, effectively legal and un-moderated component of everyday life in New Zealand. During my commute, at least 30-40% of drivers are doing it at any given time. I have even seen the police doing it.

    Can anyone argue with me, in a sensible and logical manner, that aggressive behaviour like this does not stem from people who are either (1) socially retarded, or (2) educationally retarded in regard to hazards and risk? Could it be that they even (3) intellectually retarded in regard to visualising the common future outcomes of poor risk management?

    Seriously, such behaviours in New Zealand appear to result from an undercurrent of widespread anger at the situation of the average New Zealander, hatred of other New Zealanders who may possibly have it better, and an almost universal sense of low self-esteem. I can sense this when I meet this kind of unpleasant person at work.

    So, why am I still here mixing it up with these people?

    Firstly, it is better than China, North Korea, South Africa, Mexico, et al. Congratulations.

    Secondly, we tend not to mix with New Zealanders that much at a social level anyhow. That is simply just the way it has turned out. My wife has some more mature (all 50s+) non-first generation New Zealander friends both from work and her technical social club; I have some friends too, but they are all first-generation New Zealanders like us.

    We don’t have kids.

    Most importantly, my wife is an engineer, and engineers are needed here. Our combined wage allows us to live quite comfortably. She also loves her job and gets on well with most of the engineers she works with (both imported and local).

    It has not always been so easy in New Zealand for her. My wife is Asian (Aussie educated). We first arrived in NZ years before the downturn hit, and New Zealand was absolutely crying out for engineers. Regardless, she had to work in an honest-the-god, New Zealander-owned sushi shop chain on the minimum wage for six months just to keep busy… I’m not saying they are racist, but..?

    I am no longer interested in doing science for rubbish wages. The plan is to finish off this mortgage, and take things easy. If my wife’s job bites the dust at some point (and I hope not), we will leave immediately for better job opportunities.

    My advice:
    (1) Make sure you keep some money to get out,

    (2) Watch out for the alcohol abusers and the cannabis/meth users on the road (highest cannabis/meth rates in the OECD). They are the worst,

    (3) Think twice if you are an artist or musician of some kind, if you have a sensitive nature, or if you need meaningful social contact,

    (4) Be internet savvy for entertainment and contact with the world,

    (5) If you stay for five years, but don’t live overseas for more that 6 months during this period, you are eligible for citizenship. Currently, this is your ticket to jobs in Australia,

    (6) If you are serious about staying, don’t buy either an old house (unhealthy) or a new house (poor quality). Avoid New Zealand’s ‘trades people’. Buy some land, keep it simple and, if you have the capacity, build the house yourself.


  35. As a natural born Kiwi, I totally understand this article. I am in my 50’s and over the generations I have seen this country go down hill. Especially since the late 1980’s. I have seen and experienced the erosion of basic freedoms and civil liberties by nanny-state do-gooder policies, come Police state. I have seen people and families destroyed by lack of jobs in this country, and most jobs that are available are low paid and often casualised. Which means that week by week you don’t know if you have work and what the hours may be. Say goodbye to sick pay, paid holidays and even basic human dignity without the risk of being treated like a disposal resource by your boss. The divide between rich and poor is extreme and is getting worse. Many workers in Aotearoa (New Zealand) find it difficult to get by, there is little enjoyment in life for many people in this country. WINZ is of little help, there are many more unemployed in this country than the official figures because if your partner has a job, you yourself will not be entitled to even register as a job-seeker, let alone receive any assistance. Though if you are working you will be taxed individually. This country used to be primarily socialist, the divide between rich and poor was not overly great. And most all of us could enjoy a reasonable standard of life. And any one who wanted to work, could find a job with a reasonable wage. But not any more. The Middle Class has become selfish and looks to protect itself rather than the traditional
    social concern it once had. If you are poor and out of work it is your fault. Even if their are less working class jobs available than one can count on one hand in provisional New Zealand. Stupid short sighted corporate control politics by the new financial right has destroyed this country. Idiot ideas like outsourcing for Corp A means that there is less jobs for NZ, less taxation revenue, less spending cash-flow and a greater burden on unemployment and our prisons (with all those financial and social costs) . The Corporate control politics of the new financial right continues to dumb down education, try to make prisons and hospitals and other things profit driven. Instead of loss recovery social services.
    Because if social things like hospitals make a profit, they can be sold off by the politicians – most of whom are rich and will further benefit from such sales. Just like there is no Constitution like in the USA, there is no democracy in NZ. The so-called House of Representatives only represents themselves, not the people. The system in NZ is facade where no matter who you vote for, will ignore the people. In a country where the majority is snubbed and even referendums are not binding on those who hold office. If I could get a Green Card and more to California or Texas or something I would. I think you were crazy to move to this sinking country.


    • Lenny,

      “Especially since the late 1980’s”.

      NZ’s economic and social decline from a very high-income ‘Model Nation’ seems to have occurred after the UK’s entry into the EEC and abandonment of Commonwealth trading preferences, do you agree? Neoliberal policies probably made the situation worse, but does any NZ government have much room to manoeuvre? The future doesn’t look promising.


    • @Lenny
      Well I just stumbled onto this thread. After considering a move to NZ a year ago, I was lulled into complacency and pseudo-euphoria reading all the blogs from expats and natives alike singing the praises of an idyllic land of natural beauty and freedom. But I needed a dissenting view and wanted to make an informed decision which led me here. Lenny, it just so happens i live in Texas. I was born here. By and large it is a good and stable place to live (2008 great recession notwithstanding) Your characterization of a decline in lifestyle quality and opportunity to succeed is true in America as well. While i don’t share your preference for a socialist government, I have much disdain for the decline of our own middle class here in the states and the massive income inequality brought on my billionaires and multi-millionaires who control the country from government, media, and business perspectives. I have been taken aback by the characterization of Kiwi’s as bitter, thieving, drunken people (from many other posts) who exploit children and let them run about like banshees to be raped by roastbuster, etc. I am certain this is a select few individuals or groups and does not represent the majority of the population, but i have no real data to support that. I can only draw from personal experience from a trip to NZ when i was a youngster of about 7 years where we stayed with a lovely couple who we had only met at a roadside produce stand. They invited us to their home, fed and put us up for the night. I only recall them to be generous and kind. But this was in
      1973 so the world is a far different place now.
      At issue for me is the emails i get from “Living in New Zealand” who wish to make everything easy and
      paint the rosy picture. I researched it and it would literally cost me a small fortune if i was to attempt a move and would need a guarantee of employment. Plus the requirements are always based on a college degree.
      Like some bloke working in Christchurch swinging a hammer and toting lumber around is a degreed professional? Riiiiiiiiight!! But, sure, if you want to work as a carpenter you have to have a degree. I am a 30 year construction professional and project manager without a degree. I guess its different over there.
      So, i have decided to be thankful i have what i have here in Texas, and want all to know, we don’t all have oil wells in our back yards, or cattle grazing in the front 40 acres or whatever stereotype one may have about Texans. I live in the Texas Hill country, and it is really nice. I have a job, although i make less now than i did 15 years ago. BTW, California is beautiful, but the most screwed up place to live. You would need a job that pays roughly 200K per year to afford a 1 bedroom shit hole apt and live in a crappy area. But that’s just in an area that would actually support a $200k per year job. To live south, La Jolla, San Diego,
      Etc would take serious cash. I appreciate the thoughts here even though many are negative. It is sobering to read both sides and assume reality is somewhere in the middle.


      • Your “school of hard knocks” degree would be totally useless, even thought you may be way more “qualified” than others that have their “peice of paper” hanging on the wall. There is a huge importance placed on “qualifications” that can be verified by certificate as opposed to being able to do the job. Certificates are required for almost everything, and you’ll find it hard to get work unless you toe the line.
        It WILL cost you a small fortune, and what happens to many, you’ll lose the financial mobility to move back because you’ll not be able to make/save enough.
        You’d count yourself lucky if you could get a job swinging and toting.
        PS, if I were to move back to the US, Texas would be high on the list.


        • @Carpentaro,

          Thanks for your reply. I understand the merit of having a degree as a means of continuity in the workforce.
          everyone should have quantifiable skills for what they are doing. Especially if you are traveling across the world to demonstrate said skills for an employer. A degree is highly preferred for most white collar jobs here and certifications for blue collar workers in the northern (northeast) states are typical for Union workers.
          plumbing, electrical, HVAC, Pest Control contractors must be licensed. But a carpenter can just roll up on a job, walk the walk and get hired unless you are just a piece of shit or a drunk. I guess the biggest surprise to me was the whole Christchurch rebuild. Some “happy clappers” were trying to convince me the work was plentiful and i could make a good living. Others were realists and told me that most of the work there had already been done, even years ago. So, without boots on the ground its hard to figure out the truth. I certainly wouldn’t consider moving for a life described by one guy on here where he said some Asians were living in a one room flat packed like sardines and working themselves to death. We have a huge Mexican population here in the states and in Texas that come here illegally and live the same way. I guess its better than where they came from so i cant blame them for trying to make a better life. Immigration is a sticky
          problem here cuz everyone wants to get here somehow. You would probably do well here if you ever made it over. Texas is a very good place to live. We don’t have a state income tax, housing is pretty affordable and the winters are mild. There are places to avoid tho, just like everywhere. I would stay away from Austin.
          I lived there in the late 80’s and it was wonderful. Hip, great music scene, and just a cool place to live, but now it has grown so large and housing is nonexistent and way overpriced if you want to live even remotely
          close to the city. It still has a great music scene and lots to do, and festivals, good food, etc. Just have to be
          well off to afford it and the traffic is the worst of any Texas city. Damn hippies dont want to cut a tree down to add infrastructure. Anyway, construction is booming pretty much everywhere here so there IS work.
          Best of luck to you.


          • Most of the trades you mention [elec. plumbing] have been regulated, already, here. Construction, carpenters have usually been “market” regulated. There is a process in place now where carpenters are being licenced “LBP” [licenced building practitioners] so as to relieve the local authorities of the responsabilities of “signing off” work. Problem is, cost of licencing is quite high and the responsability falls on the builder.
            There is a trend of relying on the “certificate” as a proof of competency, and that is not always the case.


          • Oh, and forgot to mention that, even though you come from a much more mature and developed industrial environment [with advanced techniques, tools, and equipment], nothing you bring to the table will be accepted as it will be deemed “WWINZ” [won’t work in NZ].
            The building techniques here are very antiquated and companies/workers under tooled [tools are few and very expensive which is why so few]. Materials are also very expensive and of less quality. Case in point; I remember [years ago] trying to find hemp to pack a cast iron DWV line that I was going to tap into and reuse. Looked all over and finally found some at an oldtimey hardware store. Hemp is still used here, all the time. Other techniques such as not using copper pipe fittings [a single coupler for 1/2″ [15mm] is $8], no double glazed windows, no screens on doors or windows [although there are way more flies in town here than on a farm in the US, the “Kiwi wave” is to shoo away the flies], ag panel sheet steel roofs on houses [usually found on out buildings and barns] is the norm, vinyl skinned masonite sheets [seratone] for shower lining. The list goes on and on. You feel like you stepped into a time warp, going back quite a few decades. So, forget all your high speed streamlined building techniques, they still cut boards with hand saws here, on a regular basis, and are proud of it. When working on a project back in the States, you’d be lucky to find 1 handsaw out of maybe 20 guys on site. Here you are expected to have and use one when a power saw is not at hand, which is often [because tools are few and expensive, remember].
            When I first got here, and went to work for a building company, I had more circular saws than the company had, that was three [2 Skil 77s and a Skil left hand blade 5 1/2″ sidewinder trim/panel saw]. They’d never seen a worm drive saw. Nobody makes a 220v wormdrive, I’ve looked.
            I’ll bet Texas is looking better and better.


          • @Carpentaro: Thanks for sharing your insights into the building industry. I do not have any type of building background aside from working as a teenager helping my dad to renovate houses when I lived in the US. The absence of standards and the lack of building quality is appalling, yet the Kiwis go on ad infinitum about how practical and capable they are. Capability is the ability to take a problem and devise a solution, rather than ignoring the problem or pretending that it does not exist.
            Here in Switzerland I often find myself astounded at the efficiency in the trades. Our refrigerator required replacing and the fellow that came had a little machine that held the refrigerator whilst it climbed up the stairs. The machine could also descend stairs with the refrigerator. I would imagine the Kiwis would take a refrigerator up four flights of stairs by bringing four of their mates to do the job that a single person can do here. They would bang the thing up the stairs instead of just having just one person quietly use a machine.
            I saw Kiwi construction first hand in Wellington. Essentially, it consisted of one guy going to a building site and taking forever to construct a single cheap house. In contrast, I saw a group of people replacing the roof on an old apartment complex here. They had a crew of people working quickly and efficiently. The guy who drove the truck that gathered the old tiles would come by exactly every ten minutes and then the roofers would toss down the old tiles. It was a pleasure to watch things run like clockwork. The efficiency and productivity here are the reasons the salaries are so high here whereas the inefficiency, poor planning, and waste are why Kiwi salaries are in the toilet and why prices are so high.


          • Carpentaro,

            Where are you from originally? You obviously Are a fish out of water. The conditions you describe would drive me batty. I am a timber framer now but built conventional framed houses here in Texas for 25 years. Nearly everyone in carpentry trades learns by apprenticeship. As you grow in knowledge and experience one is encouraged to seek a variety of methods thru books and others work. Makes you well rounded. The overriding vibe i get from your description of Life there is people are not motivated to learn, Improve, or want better methods. My mother Was in guatemala as Peace Corp volunteer and described a similar apathy and helplessness of the people to stagnate, and resist change. I too have a complete storehouse of tools for everything i do. Collected over decades i cant imagine calling myself a carpenter and trying to make a living In the competative world building here. Although, most clients i work for hire me for My skill and end product rather than how cheaply i can deliver. As you are well aware, You get what you pay for. You mentioned your Saws but i bet there is quite a problem with keeping a good supply of saw blades on hand From the supply issues and cost. God bless my friend.

            Sent from my iPhone



      • @ Benji – there are a LOT of very embittered people contributing to this site – which is understandable as it is designed that way – to provide an alternative view. Practical “degrees” are valued in NZ – probably more than “pieces of paper”.

        Honesty. Yes, commercial ethics have suffered significantly – we have perhaps the highest level of incidents of “accountants” involved in the senior leadership of our companies – far, far more so that in the US. The concern with the quarterly “bottom-line” is pervasive and deadening. Debt payments are often late and recovery of debt through court-orders (when necessary), both expensive and , basically, unenforceable. ……… Now that apart (and not unimportant of course), I live in a rural city (25,000), and rarely lock my vehicle. In 25 years I have had it rifled once – probably by a young person as only the spare cash (meter money) and a transistor were taken – not my extensive and expensive toolkit. In contrary opinion to sundry posters here – I find ordinary people just as honest as in most countries – and of course, much better than some.

        Drinking. It is pervasive here … just as pervasive as in the UK – though perhaps less so as few drink a couple of pints (beer) at lunchtime and return to work. However, there is a culture of providing alcohol on every social occasion. The excessive drinking (to the point of drunkenness) tends to be a social-level factor rather than everywhere. I have an extensive clientele and many friends – two pints has been the normal limit for many years (prior to recent 0.05 legislation). Few drunkards there.

        Violence is very well publicised here – but is generally confined to certain districts. No Columbines though, no Sandy Hooks …. I guess you have to make a balance.

        Hardware and durable housewares are expensive – and only now (after six years of the GFC), becoming truly competitive. Food on the other hand is competitive – quality for quality (sausages apart – dreadful, English style not Continental style). To make this comparative I like to keep the cost in relation to the median wage (here $NZ42,000 p.a. = $21.00 an hour …. the US is $US 39,000 nationally = $18.75 an hour …. US Dept of Stats figures, 2013).Rump steak is currently $22.00 a kilogram ($US7.30 a pound) and this compares favourably with the SAME QUALITY level of meat in California (round). In other words about 20 minutes work in both countries for a pound.Yes, you can buy is cheaper in Cal. though it is often thinner cut. On special, last week, that rump was $16.00 a kg (same quality level), say $5.30 a pound, at my local supermarket. The minimum wage is $14.25 + 8% loading for holiday pay = $15.39. Many employers of casual labour don’t comply with the law and pay the holiday pay loading. The government department charged with policing this is now grossly understaffed and is rarely able to enforce the law. Unlike the US, less than 7% of the working population is government employed.

        I have worked in five countries – NZ, Aus, California, UK and Chile – at various times and, in Aus, at the moment of a major down-turn. Chile doesn’t count as I am highly qualified in my field and that was a consultancy level. However, in all the others that did not apply and I took basic (minimum wage), jobs in order to survive. Trying to live on the minimum wage in any of those countries is definitely not easy. The great differences between NZ and Aus/UK/California were that employers did not fear differences. This enabled me to climb the ladder quite quickly (I believe the UK has now become introverted about “alien” employees) as my NZ background (and personal abilities), made me flexible – or should I say, by not being specialist I had a broader outlook to new ideas and things.

        NZ is not easy for urban Europeans (and UK citizens if they don’t think they are European) and for US/Canadians – simply that even in major cities so many of the “cultural” things so readily available there are not available here – and the myriad levels of quality and choice likewise.

        I hope that this is of interest to you and goes to balance the rather extreme negativism of various other posters. It is not Utopia – it is no worse, nor no better than any of those other countries I lived in.


      • @Lenny, I just moved here two months ago. Most all the negative comments I’ve read in these threads are true from my experience. You won’t find any middle ground. It’s embarrassing that I’ve left a great income and life in the US for this Kiwi lifestyle. Fortunately I have the means to get out but I really feel others who can’t just yet. Don’t come here unless your financially set for life or have a job lined up with a solid contract. If you need to discover what’s so great about the US then come to NZ. It’s very frustrating here on every level.


  36. The suburb I live in the Hutt which is Epuni is quite a problematic area, when it comes to weekends, the people get rowdy and drunk and sometimes they will chuck bottles over the fence, I don’t think New Zealand is going to improve, it’s going to get so downhill where I have decided that it’s better to leave once I get my Bachelor in Information Tech


  37. I’d like to add a “tale” if ok, I’m not a migrant or resident but spent 2 months there looking at what life would be like for me.

    So it started in 2011 and I was looking at possibly working abroad and had looked into Canada, I have worked in Holland and Germany, but I have friends in New Zealand.

    By trade I am a Plasterer, I run a small plastering and rendering business in the UK which is also involved with insulation, I do ok in the UK, but did get caught up with the doom and gloomers in the UK who seem to get caught up in the grass is greener syndrome, thinking that everywhere is better than the UK.

    Anyway, I decided to visit New Zealand to have a look, suss out the work situation, housing situation and generally take a look at what life would be like there, I mean New Zealand is portrayed as heaven in the UK, one of my employees even left his job because he thought I wouldn’t be back.

    I had been researching on various forums regarding construction, wages, standard of life and got caught up with the “happy clappers” and use to dismiss the negative things I saw, someone would post 1 negative comment and it would be swamped by 10 positive responses, usually from long standing members on such sites, but again, I glossed over this.

    So I booked to go and arranged to stay in Hamilton with a family I knew, flights cost me £800 approx and I was taking about £3500 or nzd$7000, plenty enough to see me through 2 months, I was even getting set up with construction site visits, meetings with small outfits and meetings with various construction guys.

    All good, until I got there, upon arrival the first thing I was asked for travelling back from the airport (Auckland) to Hamilton was money, the family I was staying with knew how much I had as I had asked about how much I needed, anyway being polite, I gave them some money about $600 to cover my stay, my understanding is I would be travelling about and visiting other friends in Auckland.

    The first few weeks were spent sight seeing, visiting tourist attractions near by money was pouring out of my hands, being generous I was paying for some of the family I was staying with as a way of showing my appreciation, however, takeaways seemed to be the norm and we probably had 1/2 home cooked meals a week.

    Groceries in stores such as countdown were massively expensive, I’m mean ridiculous, a bottle of wine and some sundries were coming in at like $40 +

    The work situation I looked into, I visited a few sites and spoke to a few guys and was actually offered jobs, I was 25 and had a skilled trade, so had opportunities, however the wages were not great $27-$30 NZD per hour in a country that is very expensive, I earn more than that in the UK.

    The Christchurch re-build was a joke, an absolute shambles, speaking to various site managers the Chinese were the only guys earning money, by working 12-14 hours days producing good quality work but living in shared accommodation and basically living poorly earning money to send home, something I wasn’t prepared or expecting to do, I was expecting long term work, decent pay and a decent standard of living……. Where was it ?

    One site manager actually discouraged me and told me how he was only there to obtain a visa so he could jump the ditch and move to Aus, his words were “you’ll struggle like hell” he couldn’t fault the Chinese either, they were working hard and fast towards a bonus for said site manager, other sites were the same, hamilton hospital, sites in Tauranga, Maori gib stoppers, Chinese gib stoppers, either earning little or working very long hard days to earn a decent crust.

    Not like the adverts you see in Britain.

    I also looked into the private housing as regards to buying, and being into construction and insulation myself I know the state of the housing was disgusting, it was summer when I was there but there was no or very little insulation, timber framed housing cladded with weatherboard and plastic cladding, these houses are not built to last, the nights were very cold.

    NZ is very behind on building materials, things are simply not available in New Zealand that are readily available in Europe, what materials and tools that are on offer are massively overpriced.

    The houses are simply massively inflated, they are of poor quality and certainly do not justify the price they demand $200,000 for a rotting timber home in a rough area, no matter how big the garden is or what you can see from said garden, the houses are wooden tents/sheds even.

    Condensation – the meeting of cold air and warm air resulting in water, why the hell do you not have double glazing, why the hell do you not insulate your houses – the result is water inside your home, water rots wood, it rots plasterboard.

    I’ll move onto attitude – the attitude when criticised is dramatic, wow, see the change on their faces when you dare criticise anything, I’d made my mind up about moving after about a month, it was a no, how my life was made hell for the remaining time, racism towards the maori is common, as such is it towards Indians and Chinese.

    Expats are by far the worse, they hate Britain and speak very lowly of the place, I got sick to the back teeth of hearing how bad Britain was, how it was being taken over, how it was a sinking ship, give it a rest, the UK has its problems but it is a great place to live, everything in life is at your fingertips education, careers, opportunities.

    I got the impression expats where hoping the UK had problems to justify their own choice to move to New Zealand.

    Kiwi-poms get no greater pleasure in life than to tell people in the UK how great there life is, when really it is sugarcoated bullshit.

    The isolation, that word will stick with me for life, I have never felt isolation like I did in New Zealand, not loneliness, but just a complete lack of anything, nothingness. What kept me going was having access to the Internet, I felt I was looking elsewhere to get my sports fix regarding football, F1 and other sports, other than rugby and cricket, there’s no mainstream sports access.

    Tourists are squeezed for every last penny, I ended up broke with a few days remaining and was made to feel very uncomfortable, I’d given my host family who were friends near $1000, spent copious amounts on take-outs (I have 1/2 a week in UK, not 4/5) spent hundreds on overpriced tourist attractions and my fair share in fuel (the last I have no qualms about as I did see some great sights)

    But I was left broke, I couldn’t even afford a beer in the airport.

    I did see my friend who lives in Auckland, who I hadn’t seen since I was a child, when I met him he was very against me moving to NZ, at the time I couldn’t understand why, but it soon clicked when I got back, we spoke and he told me he regretted ever moving there, he owned his house and had a job, but like me, felt the isolation, the squeeze and the endless battles with your own sanity, the reason he cannot leave is, he is married to a kiwi with 2 children, she will never leave, kiwi women are very controlling and manipulative and most are overweight pigs, in other words he is stuck.

    I left New Zealand scratching my head, questioning my own attitude, I couldn’t understand why I didn’t fit into this great, green heaven id read so much about, I was made to feel like I had a problem.

    New Zealand does that to you, the people, the place, it isolates you unless your willing to paint a fake smile on your face, appreciate the view and say thank you while zipping your trousers up.

    I don’t regret going, it has made me appreciate what the UK has given me and continues to offer.

    Luckily for me I was strong enough and wise enough to see through the bullshit, I spent my time in New Zealand living as a resident, living in a home, looking at jobs, looking at housing and mixing with residents on a day to day basis.

    My strong advice to anyone is visit first and the if you like it rent, do not sell everything you have (a house) on a whim and move because getting out is one long hard slow process.

    I now live in UK, own my own home and run a successful business, something I don’t think I could have done in New Zealand, good luck people.


      • I can afford to retire in NZ, if I sell my house here in Oz. As a matter of fact I have wanted to move over there since I first visited in 1976. I feel it is my spiritual home, the place I am most happy. I have studied IN DEPTH the pros and cons of living there, and I still ache to do it. I am 61 years old and my working days are over. The places I would want to settle over there are small communities (there are four in particular I would choose from) which have all the facilities I would need or want (access to health care, a senior citizens group, close proximity to hot spring bathing, reasonable access to shops and public transport, and a seemingly close-knit, welcoming community). I am well aware of the cultural problems, gangs, drunkenness etc but my quiet lifestyle would not, I hope, expose me to the negative side of living in NZ. However our wise Australian Prime Minister has destroyed my dream of the last 40 years by announcing that Australians who receive a pension can now not spend more than four weeks (in any year) living outside of Australia or they will lose their pension. I worked out that if I sold up everything except personal effects here I could afford to buy a house in an area I want, and afford to buy a car and furnish my house with second-hand furniture. I could easily have existed on my Australian pension. My demands and requirements are not huge, just a quiet life and a hot swim nearly every day, fresh air, hopefully a few friends. When I spent time in NZ last year and in 2013 I shopped wisely and I honestly did not find that the cost of groceries was much different to what I pay here.

        I realise I am in a completely different position from the young ones on here who have careers and want to work, or have children (I only have my 3 dogs). But it really hurts to want to go so badly and now not be able to. If anyone can offer any advice I would like to hear it!


        • Jane, I suspect that you may be entitled to a pension from New Zealand – have a little research into that. As an Australian you are automatically entitled to Permanent Residency as soon as you step foot in New Zealand, in which case, I would think you would be eligible for pension – but I could be wrong. With that said, I don’t think it would very difficult for an Australian to become a NZ citizen (although it’s much more difficult for a New Zealander to become an Aussie citizen), in which case I think you would be eligible for a pension in New Zealand (just not your Australian one). Hope that helps.


          • Yes you could be wrong. Jane West please seek accurate information and guidance from someone who knows what they’re talking about before making the move.

            Please be aware the NZ pension payments are not usually backdated. If you make a mistake and don’t claim your proper entitlements you will lose out


      • Hi uk builder, you are totally right about NZ. If you are from UK do not move to NZ from UK , as you will eventually become very bored with the isolation, narrow mindedness of people here, their bigoted and xenophobic views of other countries and people. Plus their extreme nationalism and racism. The pretty countryside is not a good reason to leave leave your home country and live in second rate NZ.


        • Rich, although I respect what you say I cannot agree with you entirely. New Zealand is NOT second rate. After living here for 10 years, I can say with authority it is distinctly third rate.


    • UK Biker: “kiwi woman are controlling and manipulative and most are fat pigs”-that’s a bit harsh isn’t it? IF they are (en masse) controlling at times it could be because: 1)this is effectively a misogynistic police state (as a woman I feel increasingly threatened when in public or when dealing with the government) and 2) to be fair a lot of men here have severe substance abuse/alcohol problems. Both of these issues make woman feel unsafe or at the very least anxious and anxious people will grasp at any sense of control they can get. 3) few kiwi men stand up for or protect women from anything let alone there own alcoholism. I have more than once had to break up domestic abuse that has occurred right in front of men that ignored it and continued to drink and do nothing. NZ society (women as much as men) fairly regularly treat and talk about women terribly. We have one of the highest sexual violence rates in the world. I think you lack insight into what it’s like to be a woman in NZ-which makes sense given your a brit and a male one at that. So maybe rather than adding to the culture of violence and abuse with your words above you could take a step back and recognise that it is entirely possible that where NZ woman are concerned you don’t know the first thing about what you are talking about.


  38. Good article. I’m glad me and my husband were not the only family that had a bad NZ experience. It was tricky for us as I’m from Singapore and my husband is from the UK and we met and got married in NZ. Although we had our fun and loving memories of NZ, we encountered very bad ones too. The bad housing situation like houses over there were not insulated was so true as we had a similar problem too. Our heating bills went up to nzd800 for a month! We also had that same experience that NZ was trapping us in as we did not have enough finances to leave. But once we had the chance of leaving, we gladly did it even when it was so very difficult. We had to work in Australia for a length of time just to be able to save up enough money to resettle in our native countries, Singapore and finally UK which was not easy either. Even with good paying jobs, we were left out of pocket because of the high living standards. Kiwi wages were and are still too low for Kiwi living stardard. New Zealand is a very beautiful place to visit but too costly to live in. As for us, my husband ended up working all over the world earning the British Pound, we come back to the UK or fly away to any country every 6 to 8 weeks and not have hassle to resettle anywhere anymore. We glad we came to NZ but we are happier that we left.


    • congrats on doing so ! we are still fighting to get back. and hope we will succeed. Yeah travelling to other countries often is also what we miss


  39. I like to let the people who comment on this page know that a few years ago a local Hong Kong newspaper did a survey on New Zealand expats who live in Hong Kong or Mainland China and the survey results were surprising, the people surveyed said that they would never return to New Zealand when they retire


    • In other words you know him well enough to know his history and his motives, but not what he said? o_O

      Trolls can be real people and they can be migrants, they take many different forms and have varying agendas.

      …a crafty troll will present just enough evidence of being credible that to block them would seem like a dangerous step towards infringing free speech. Such trolls will even use this defence, and accuse those who block them of cowardice, censorship, and losing the argument. The average individual is left stuck between doing the morally upstanding thing (upholding free speech, engaging in a debate) and the wise thing (protecting their own peace of mind)

      or the peace of mind of their readers.

      Read the comments guidelines. They’re quite straightforward. While you’re about it read the reason for this site – Welcome

      Don’t like that? find the zero tolerance policy not to your taste? Don’t comment. Move on. Simple.



    • So, until now you didn’t realize trolls were real people who post online? What did you think they were – computer generated?!!!


  40. Plain Jane,

    I am so sorry to hear your child was injured in such pointless way. Children should never be in a situation like that! The US is a large place and we have many infrastructure issues. I have never seen a school in such disrepair here, though. The building codes are so strict regarding materials and construction methods, and engineers must approve drawings to 3 times a factor of safety. To constantly here about leaky cold houses over there just boggles my mind. Insulation in general is one of the cheapest materials we have. Why any sensible person charged with building a structure wouldnt stuff the walls and ceiling cavities full of it is insane. Especially, at the prices they charge for those damn houses there. I only hope you have found safe haven somewhere sensible where you dont have to be concerned a beam or door will fall off and kill or mame someone, especially a child. God Bless!!


      • I am astounded. The problems you describe Are so unbelievably easy to remedy at the time of construction if you dont walk around with your head in your arse. Yet the outcomes of such negligence cause the proems you describe. I wish i could just build you a proper house that is safe and warm. My prayers go out to you. Noone should have To put up with that. So many stories i have read on this blog echo your plight. It is absolutely ridiculous to think this still goes on in this day and age. Please know you and the many folks who are dealing with this are being Prayed over. So happy your son is in a better place as this must give you some solace.

        Warmest regards,


        Sent from my iPhone



    • The counter-intuitive logic of “increased circulation” [to combat TB], fight off moisture…
      It boggles the mind, with the cost of energy and the restrictions on wood stoves, why insulation is not more widely used and accepted.


  41. Dear Plain Jane, Thank you so much for your very interesting comments about my desire to move to NZ. I have been over there five times since the 70’s, and bathed in something like 40 hot springs ranging from puddles in farmers’ paddocks to luxury spas, and I am very aware of the risks of amoebic meningitis; I know not to put my head under! (Thanks.) I found the link about the pensions very helpful indeed and with the aid of Centrelink here and various other sites I find that I can still claim my Australian pension.
    Your comment “do you really think as an Australian you would be warmly accepted” chilled me rather. I would really hope that being an Australian, New Zealand residents would not regard me as foreign enough to be an enemy, I love the place and the people, but realise that living there is different to being on holidays. I’m an older person, too, and don’t make waves. There is a lot of negativity on the website here, but most people’s circumstances are completely different from mine – they are looking for work and have children to consider as well.
    Crime happens here, too. My small town in central Victoria (population 3000) has been named “the Ice capital of Australia” thanks to a very biased documentary broadcast by the ABC highlighting the drug problems of just one very small group of people. I know there are some racial issues between Maori/Pakeha, as there are between white/Aboriginal Australians, but I guess we have less problems here. I think wherever you go there are bound to be some kind of problems, but I am hoping my positive attitude would see me through. I have many and varied interests and would like to be involved with whatever activities for seniors are on offer.
    Like you said, I think I just have to bite the bullet and do it, life here does not offer me much so I would like to live the rest of it somewhere where I really want to be.


  42. Dear Plain Jane,
    You are right about coming into contact with problems regarding crime and violence. When we were over there in 1991 we were in Whakatane, walking to a restaurant for dinner and saw a gang of Maori youths overturning and torching a car in a side street. Also staying in Russell we went for a drink in one of the pubs but everyone in the bar stopped talking, the guitar player stopped playing and we swallowed our drink as fast as we could as we were obviously not welcome there. But my circumstances have changed 100%. I did notice when I was there in 2013 and 2014 there seemed to be a lot of aimless youths hanging around shopping centres. I still feel positive about moving over there, as NZ seems to offer me what I want in my senior years. If you want to get out of there, maybe you would like to buy my house!!! Cheers!
    Sorry about the cat problem. The only thing I can suggest is you keep looking after the cat, get it into condition and get it desexed as the owners are obviously going to ignore the problem. How did they find out who the owners were anyway? Over here microchipping and registration is compulsory where I live for domestic cats and dogs but some people choose to ignore the rules, and always will I guess.


  43. I am very disappointed for a so called “first world” nation the low standards of everything here( eg terrible building quality, low quality school and tertiary education, poor quality and limited range of supermarket food, anti education, anti intellectual, discrimination against high achievers a.k.a tall poppy syndrome, hiring either the cheapest person for a even a top level job or one’s mate, horrible roads and terrible driving skills)

    Then the ridiculously high cost of living, for services – rip of prices for everything. Thanks to the asians and other immigrant in auckland I have cheaper alternatives at fairly good quality

    Then we have the superficially /artificially polite( but never truly friendly) locals ( Not all of course) who are multi faced, backstab you frequently, dishonest, racist, small minded and petty.THe locals do not like immigrants at all and do not want anything to do with immigrants except taste their food sometimes. Immigrants are much more than food, dear kiwis. You can learn a lot from us like family values, thrift, hard work, excellence, hiring on merit, being frank and straight to the face, productivity, new knowledge etc

    Worst of all is the dishonest job market where many jobs are falsely advertised as there really is not many new positions created, fraudulent job search agencies who interview for jobs which they already have found the person, discriminate against highly skilled workers by saying they do not like your accent, you are over qualified and you lack local experience( even experience from another kiwi town does not count as if christchurch in a a different nation from Auckland- the parochial bastards)
    Then you learn give the position to a close to an illiterate and uneducated kiwi mate of the company boss.

    You cannot trust any local here as theyl will talk to you in a friendly manner and you think they are your friend but they are waiting to complain behind your back just to be one up on you or to bully you

    EVen the scenery in NZ is over rated. There are many other more beautiful places in the world, North American and Alaska, South America, Switzerland, Austria, Scotland, the Mediteranean nations, tropical paradises like hawaii , malaysia ,kerala, fiji

    The only thing good is the lack of people , lack of congestion and clean air and some immigrants who are nice and fiendly

    Toxic people in a nation meant only for very rich retired people who do need to mix with the locals


    • You have nailed mate, I read truth and true experience in your text. Before I found this website/blog I had no one to talk to so I had only myself to give and take reference from. I am so relieved that we have a voice on here, thank you Admin people for giving us the chance to get it off our shoulders and share these very real experiences. It is not a 1st world country indeed, we have serious medical staff shortages. But I know my way around now, I choose to go to an immigrant doctor, choose to ask questions to an Asian, always go out of my way to wait in a que where there is an Asian to help me – they are so much more pleasurable to work with and so polite, they can smile and really mean it. I am so tired of dealing with rude impolite kiwis from caravan sales to medical staff, they have no sense of service & comradeship. I am here for the most beautiful landscapes and clean air and lack of people, there are worse situations in other countries so I found a way to make life a little more pleasing by making these choices like choosing to interact with Asians and other immigrants who do the job better, I still have to meet that warm hearted kiwi who will offer me a cuppa one day – 6 years I am still waiting despite all my invitations that all went avoided which is a common culture.


  44. ok! having read almost all of the comments, I think it’s too late for me to back out! moving to NZ this year. Great! Still hoping for the best though.


    • Good luck, there is a large Filipino community in New Zealand to welcome you. But if you’re using a work-to-residence visa there’s a few things you need to be aware of.

      Read these articles, they’ll explain why.


  45. I grew up in NZ , had a fabulous childhood there, I’m actually thinking of returning after being in Australia for 30 years..I am so over the traffic here, the heat, the bugs and sore losers lol. Time to go home, aaah beautiful NewZealand, where the Tui sings in the Kowai tree and the sun tips the mountain tops with Gold!


      • Kowhai….God you are such an abruti…. Americans are just so full of merde. I am not from NZ but i can assure you that i would choose to live there over anywhere in America, based on the fact that they are both countries where good incomes are necessary to allow you to enjoy life but at least Kiwis are not hypocrite abou it and fake smiling at all times(i freacking hate this about North americans…cant be genuine) . Grown up kiwis that i know are way more interesting to hang around than hilariously dumb yanks who all think they are educated.In USA: No wealth no education.Period. I doubt any of you knows anything about Voltaire so before you start dropping names for the sake of sounding smart maybe you should face the fact that your country was/is/will be built on foreigners intellect.


        • smiling at all times
          At least they’ve got something to smile about. Rather presumptuous to think you know what they are thinking, don’t you think? You wouldn’t have to worry about smiling faces if you were in NZ, everyone is grumpy.
          You’d be a good fit, they obviously saw right through your pretensions in the States.


        • This is the sentence many have said before making the move….”I am not from NZ but i can assure you that i would choose to live there over anywhere in America”.

          We will all wait for your post-landing-experience-posts-or-comments after you bring in your life savings and work tirelessly 24/7 just so that millions of people can survive on dole paid by taxes from the working community.

          Oh BTW “foreigners intellect”? I think its high time you research a bit more, all of your “interesting” friends also fall under the same category unless they were born from the molten lava.


  46. I’m so sorry you are having a tough time here. I agree with almost all of what you say and I am a kiwi. I am certain I can help you or your husband get in a better position over here and if you are still in New Zealand please reply to this post and I will find a way of getting in touch with you to help you out. All cannot be lost yet! p.s. I can assure you that I can hold a conversation about things other than Rugby and you are most welcome for a cup of tea and a biscuit anytime.


    • Hi! I’m Clara,38 yrs,married,with 3 kids.I’m not a professional but do you think I can still find a job in New Zealand? Im honest, hardworking and can work under pressure with minimal supervision.Thanks


  47. One other thought I had is that public schools have a thing called a ‘decile’ rating. I can explain the misunderstanding that may lead to the belief that students from NZ can’t or won’t perform well internationally privately but as far as schools go you need to live ‘in zone’ for the good public ones. There are good public schools-you just need to know where.


  48. NZ schools do have reports/grades and meetings with teachers etc, I can speak to my three children’s teachers at anytime. The decile rating is a reflection of the local economic prosperity, or otherwise. There is no reflection on the standard of teaching. In fact lower decile schools maybe better funded. Higher decile schools require more parent ‘voluntary donations’. We have found with our three children there can be quite a bit of snobbery as well, as children reflect their parents sentiments at higher decile schools.
    Govt benefits such as working for families or subsidised childcare, tax credits, are geared to those in work. To be fair, they amount to a low income subsidy, many NZ employers wouldn’t survive without them, or at least be making a lot less money, yes many NZ workers are poorly paid, the govt encourages both parents to work. If we moved back say 25 years to one income earner the power would shift to the employee, now we have a slight surplus of workers.
    The initial article mentioned corn… Never seen substandard corn as was described on sale. Suggest a different retailer.
    Most Kiwi’s are friendly and welcoming, some immigrants can be quite stand offish till they get to know people or wish to continue to experience the benefits while living their old way with no desire to become part of their new home, what’s the point?
    If you come here and expect to make your fortune, you are likely to disappointed, many things are quite expensive compared to what you earn, if do you would like a great quality of life, you should be happy. Consider smaller centres rather than the larger ones. We live in New Plymouth, my wife leaves for work a max of five minutes before work… bit better than what you may have experienced, at least you have your travel costs knocked on the head as well as the extra day a week you spent traveling to and from work.


      • We switched roles, I ‘m now the quote ‘primary caregiver’ and my wife works full time. Has worked well for us. Previous had traveled twenty minutes each way, and had to use my own vehicle. Public transport can be expensive and not efficient unless it is directly point to point at the right time(s).
        Re the initial article referring to a lot of “clunkers” on the road, the following comment referred to an inability to afford to pay for maintenance to pass the twice yearly safety inspection, (WOF). So if the vehicles pass a stringent safety inspection they can’t really be classed as clunkers. Some of the vehicles you see in some states in the U.S. with rotted sills etc, would never be on the road here. We also benefit from a vast selection of different models you wouldn’t find elsewhere. Remember, no new vehicle is environmentally friendly in its manufacture and eventual disposal. You may not like the cost of gas though…
        You need to weigh up in truth what you are looking for, and decide whether you will find what you are looking for, remember where ever you go, you take yourself.


  49. I will say that “traffic” in NZ [except for major centers] is quite a bit less. In the States, driving 1.5 hours in the morning and 2 hours coming home was not out of the question. So, having a 10-15 min commute was nice and the offsetting cost of fuel was a boost to the bottom line.
    I do not like the intrusive WoF process. I have always liked to hotrod erm improve vehicles. This is not easy to do here as most things HAVE to stay the same as vehicle was delivered. Changing engines, suspension, brakes, all need “certification” from some government bureaucrat.
    “Some of the vehicles you see in some states in the U.S. with rotted sills etc, would never be on the road here.” Yet these vehicles seem to be able to survive quite well on the road otherwise they be parked. Makes you wonder if the “safety” inspections are really necessary or just there to protect people from a lack of common sense.


    • I have heard of relatives in Auckland taking up to one and a half hours each way, that’s something I wouldn’t like to experience.
      It appears you can still do most things automotive in NZ if you follow the right path, and pay someone to certify. You would be right re our WOF, kind of an indicator that we can’t be trusted to use common sense. Unfortunately there is someone (govt) that will provide the ‘guidance’ we need, how thankful I am, not.
      Ever notice how light switches etc should be installed by a licenced, qualified professional yet you can buy them at any hardware no questions asked?
      The building sector is getting more regulated yet there is still provision for self build under the new regulations.
      Personally I prefer a lot less regulation, but it all changed through the eighties. I find it all to intrusive, but today’s younger people have grown into it and largely accept the norm.
      The house I live in has tripled in value since 2000, unfortunately my income hasn’t even doubled in the same period.
      I believe we were better off prior to ‘user pays’, my children will have it harder in many ways i.e. buy a house, suppose we can’t turn the clock back though now.


      • ” and pay someone to certify”. So, you have to pay to play. I’ve done most “maintenance” on my vehicle, I’m just waiting for someone [at the WoF] to tell me that I’d “need a cert to do that”.
        In the States, a home owner can do pretty much anything, electrical, plumbing. I guess there is an implied responsibility that you don’t want to do harm to your own house. Heck, it wasn’t that long ago that people used to build their own houses [with no formal training]. People are getting dumbed down by being not allowed to do things for themselves. I still try to do as much as I can, just so that it makes life interesting.


  50. I agree there is an attempt to dumb down the population with the idea we can’t be trusted to do anything ourselves, at least that’s what it seems like. Who are these people that desire to control our enterprise? Majority I have met drive a keyboard and have little if any, practical experience. They themselves believe that you need a ‘qualified’ person to perform all manner of really simple tasks, they reflect their own lack of ability on to others, the idea that if they can’t do it, how can you possibly be able?
    There is still facility to build your own house, as for needing to certify vehicle modifications, I understand while there is some cost, it’s reasonably straight forward. The problem was in the past those who modified vehicles and did some really stupid stuff, followed by the accident, media drama, them you have the keyboard mob step in and someone decides we need regulation. Truth is that the WOF check should really have uncovered the defect, but things were let go. What happens in the states when you modify a vehicle unsafely? Do you open yourself up to being sued? At least we didn’t have the cash for clunkers programme, not that it wasn’t suggested.


  51. A law suit may be the result. Most times, vehicle modification is safe enough to not result in anything bad happening. Putting yourself in a vehicle that you altered should be enough to make sure that things are safe.
    There are some vehicles [in NZ] that you wonder how they got WoFed. Maybe on the road illegally? So, no real guarantee of “safety”.
    Bureaucrats have to create rules that factor to the lowest common denominator so we’re all drug down. I hate being penalised for someone else’s idiotic actions. The “nanny state” is not an environment that encourages innovation. “Nanny state” rules are alive and well in NZ and seem to only hold back the law abiding folks, the ones that need regulation are beyond the grasp of the law.
    “Cash for clunkers” was a stimulus [political] program, pure and simple, had nothing to do with cars.
    There are certain alterations that are used quite often and have been for some time that are not allowed in NZ with out a “certification”. Tires and wheels over a certain %, lift shackles, engine size/swap, transmission swap, all mainstays of “hotrodding”. The truck that I drove for years [State side} would have been “illegal” unless hundreds were spent on “certification”, yet it worked better, was safer, and lasted longer than as delivered by the factory with a few modifications that were easily done by me without some bureaucrat looking over my shoulder.
    There are some states that require periodic inspections. But they just check for lights, tread depth [not size], horn… Very non intrusive. Then there are some states that say “maintain vehicle in roadworthy” condition. Serious violations can be caught by equipment checks by police. Lets face it, they know it when they see it. And there are not vehicles flying off the road because they are not safe. It hasn’t been the problem that it is made to be in NZ.
    All in all, I don’t see much benefit in the over regulation, unless common sense is so uncommon that there is an attempt to regulate it. That has a very low index of probability of success.


  52. I have to agree with a lot of these comments, I have been here 19 years and I am totally bored with it, just got back a holiday in the UK and can’t believe how expensive we are compared to there, our small plastic box of raspberries are $6 each, in my local market over there they were selling 2 for 1.50 pounds, cleaning stuff was 1 pound while it is $4 here so double in price, I need a crown, my dentist has quoted $4000, it would cost me $438 in the UK (according to the dentist’s website) my dentist also wants $200 to clean and polish my teeth, it was 19 pound on the same website I was reading. What no one has mentioned are the kiwi guys, I am married to one (I came with an English one but we divorced) and my daughter was married to one too, they can be very nasty, ie start shouting at you for nothing, just in the middle of a conversation, these are not the only 2, I have friends who say their partners do the same, kiwi men are very chauvinistic compared to English ones, all my family and friends are still with the same husbands as when I left and they are all still being treated really well by them, not shouted or swore at, it’s like something just switches on in their brains and we have noticed the same trait in my young grandson who has a Kiwi dad who isn’t interested in him, ie he will just start shouting at us so we are gonna go back to the UK, my daughter, son and ex have never liked it here but I loved it originally but now wish I was back over there, (and have done for years now) I have been everywhere here numerous times, ie Auckland, Wellington, etc, it’s all just the same old, same old but there are so many places back there I haven’t visited. Another thing I have always hated here is Christmas, (even when i liked it here) jit’s ust another day, no atmosphere like in the UK and my ex hated the fact that Christmas was also summer holiday time then he had all year to work without a proper break as he had to have a month off at Christmas as the firm shut down.


  53. I was born in New Zealand and have lived here for my whole life (23 years). I am a white male with a New Zealand accent and well off parents. I have a tertiary degree. Since I got my degree the only work that I have been able to find is minimum wage work with no guaranteed hours. If you don’t fit into the culture here, as I don’t at all, then you don’t have much hope.I dislike Rugby and all this nature trash. I live in Auckland and the traffic is horrific at all hours of the day. The women here are all bland, self obsessed, arrogant, drunken pigs who think they’re all 10’s. The men are mostly all rugby obsessed idiots. The only activities that they participate in seem to be going out for a beer. The food here is disgusting. Restaurants charge obscene prices for food that’s of a lower quality than a Chilli’s. Also after 10pm if you want to eat your options are McDonalds or BurgerKing, which are also much more expensive than in other countries. There are a lot of fights here. No one backs down from a fight. Even if you were an experienced cage fighter that would not deter the local idiots from trying to fight you. I very much want to leave. PS Australia is basically the same as far as the people. There may be more employment opportunities though.


    • i found your comments interesting, as we are very different but seem to feel the same way. female born and raised in nz (31 years), half moari/pakeha. raised in poor family, farther.. no father of the year award will be coming his way any time soon, super women mother. no degree, find work easily, decent pay and hours. i don’t care for rugby i have no problem with others going crazy over it, i love nature, camping, hikes ect, NOT a fan for the beach i love nz food. i live in a small crpy town, its the people that make it crpy. i recently went on holiday to europe for 3 months, i loved it, the people there in all honesty made me feel so ashamed of kiwis, kiwi guys walk around like they have a spade up there arse, cabbages under there arms, barking like dogs, cheat when they fight, example: in groups, with weapons, they pick on some one they feel they can easily intimidate, the girls: jealousy, butch, have no class, lie, fight, cheat when they fight. i did not see this kind of behavior in europe.
      so much violence towards women in relationships……. girls stay with them.
      parents encourage there children to disrespect adults, swear, steal, bully, fight, witness violence & drugs. kids are witnessing things they should not, they are exposed to all kinds of dangerous situations. but in saying all of this, not all kiwis are this way, sadly its what i have seen alot of, (i prefer to have friends who are not kiwi) also i think kiwis are very easy going (just watch your back), they accept you for who you are, rich or poor, stupid or smart. kiwis are more laid back. there are good kiwis, you just have to be able to pick the real from the cr*p.
      i dont want to live in nz!!!! i aim to move to europe with my partner who is french, i dont want to look back, i agree with your comment people in australia are no different.

      my suggestion to any one, if you plan to move to nz you NEED to be open minded, patient, chilled and able to look at the bright side of everything


      • Hi there,

        Thank you for your honesty. It is good to hear the an sincere story from the kiwi side.

        You are most welcome in Europe. Europeans are quite open for foreigners and I am sure they will accept you. Almost everybody speaks English and you may have figured life is quite a bit cheaper there.

        I am not against all kiwis but it just have made us sad not to be accepted in kiwi society after almost 4 years..

        Even though we have tried many things and met many kiwis. They never invite us or invite us back. We also find it depressing to be around them cause most of them seem to regret to live here. Ofcourse nature is stunning. But better to admire that in a holliday with lots of western cash in your pocket.

        I am very glad there are honest kiwi’s out there and you deserve a better life. Very glad you found it in France !



        • hi, 4 years! that just shows what im talking about, thats not nice to hear especially after i felt extremely welcomed by many through my europe travels. we are currently located in the north island, hawkes bay, but we travel as often as we can and love meeting new people preferably not kiwi :/ if you like we can keep in contact, you never know when our paths could be crossing, i dont have face book but i have skype and gmail if you are interested. my gmail is arijc08@gmail.com


  54. I Guess Some Northern Hemisphere People will Think Heading South Means it is Warmer like Up North America. heading South to Florida .Guess What it is the OPPOSITE Down Here…I Met a UK Couple who Bought a South Facing Section and Built a House to Face South. But it Should be Facing North…to get the Sun. Some International Qualifications are NOT Accepted in NZ so you Need to Re Sit exams to get the NZ Qualifications.If you a re “Friendly” then you will make Friends. If You Moan about Everything in NZ then Kiwi’s will Avoid you.I have Heard of a UK person Moaning about NZ for about 10 years and they returned to the UK but were Back here in less than 6 Months as UK had “Changed” while they were away.


  55. I found this such a sad story to read, it must be horrible to be ‘trapped’ somewhere with not much hope of change. Have you thought about a crowdfunder or kickstarter to get back home or Australia? We are Kiwis who live in the UK then came to Perth because our family moved there, and we are so lucky that happened. Our kids have amazing opportunities to get into the 5 universities here and my husband was lucky to get into mining 18 years ago so we could afford private schooling for our children on one income. Things have certainly slowed down here but Perth has such a positive vibe, no doubt from the amazing weather. We visit NZ alot to see relatives and are constantly shocked at the sheer poverty and bad weather. Rugby is reported in the front section of the paper not just the sport pages – like you we think Aussies are AFL mad until we go back home and see the insanity of the Rugby culture. None of our friends and relations in NZ take overseas trips or even visit the tourist attractions in NZ. Last time we were home we visited Hobbiton – none of our huge extended family have been there. Another huge advantage of Australia is the superannuation fund where employers pay 9% minimum of your salary (not out of your salary) into a fund which is then invested for retirement.
    Good luck to you and your family.


  56. [Deleted. You’ve obviously developed a taste for kool-aid in the 30 years you’ve lived in New Zealand. Please don’t troll. Admin ]


  57. I am an Australian citizens with Australian citizen children. I spent many years in Christchurch and I can’t help but to feel you too live in the South Island.
    If you do, leave, because everything you wrote is true.
    I left and moved to Auckland where I live on the North Shore with my two children alone. Their Father is a kiwi born Cantabrian.
    I learnt that kiwis are extremely click, in Christchurch.
    I judges N.z on CHCH for a Lo g time and now that I have been IN Auckland for 2yrs I see N.Z in such a different light.
    There is culture, educated people, happy kids who aren’t locked indoors by 5pm cause its so freezing out. Great schools especially if you go the Catholic route, plenty of jobs.
    I hear your story loud and clear and yes your observations are real.
    What about Auckland?
    I wanted to go home to.Aussie but by court order had to stay in N.Z cause the kids Dad is a kiwi. I’ve now won my battle and can leave Jan 2016 but think Im happy to stay. We have a great lifestyle here.good job. Happy kids at kindy and school. People are ALOT more friendly and worldy. Auckland is pretty cool on the Nth Shore


    • Is that because there are so many immigrants living there that it doesn’t feel like New Zealand? Interesting point about you finding the lifestyle great, many of our readers comment on the lack of open space (e.g. the urbanisation of Long Bay), poor public transport, intensely dense housing, kids getting left behind in massive high schools, long traffic jams at rush hour and the fact that virtually every lot is subdivided (people have a another house in either their front or back yard).


      • I think what Mollie found was her niche where she personally feels comfortable. Known people who still live ‘down south’ and happier than a puppy in a bowl of gravey. Any area (anywhere) will have its lets say ‘characteristics’, just a case of are to your liking? You know how you can get two people talking about the same thing as if it wasn’t the same?


    • Mollie, my husband and I are thinking of moving to NZ in approx 2/3 years because my daughter in law is a kiwi and she and my son along with their two boys are moving there to Auckland. He has already secured a good job on a good salary and been approved for a good mortgage. She has been away for 19 years. It will be retirement for both my husband and I and we should be financially secure with savings, profit from our home and our pensions. We have been in the USA for 9 years now but are originally from the UK. From what I have been reading on here, especially from Jeff, I am now just a little concerned to say the least. It is bad enough in many areas of the states, where we live we do not really “see” any trouble but from what Jeff is saying it sounds like NZ is full of alcoholics, Chinese and Indians !!! We will be placing a house on my son’s land which they can afford to buy, my husband is a contractor here, so doing anything in a house is not a problem, we will not need to hire anyone. Can you give me a true perspective of what life in NZ is “really” like


      • Valerie please be aware that some councils will only permit one dwelling per unit of land, you’re advised to wait until your son and DIL have actually purchased land and you’re clear about the zoning requirement before you commit yourself to anything. If your son intends to sub-divide a section the costs of doing so are quite high and land around AKL is already some of the most expensive in the world.

        One more thing, your DIL has been away from NZ for 19 years. Many Kiwis find it hard to re-establish after being away for so long. Be sure that she and your son are going to stay before you move over. Give them a year or two before you and your husband commit. Also, be aware that once your grandchildren are resident in NZ it will be virtually impossible for one parent to remove them if the other decides to stay, regardless of where they were born or what nationality they are. You may like to advise your son of this.


        • I would not completely divest from your holdings in the US. Maintaining a “safety net” would be a wise move. No one wants to consider [from the outset] reversing such a move, but it would be prudent to have that avenue open, just in case.
          Several people have rented their houses [long term] so as to not completely sever the possibility of returning.
          You’ll know in a year or two, then you can make a more accurate assessment.


      • “I am now just a little concerned to say the least. It is bad enough in many areas of the states, where we live we do not really “see” any trouble but from what Jeff is saying it sounds like NZ is full of alcoholics, Chinese and Indians !!! ”

        Valerie, with that attitude you’ll find many kindred spirits in New Zealand. Too many locals bemoan the influx of foreigners and “darkies” like Chinese and Indians. Anyway, I’m surprised you were able to glean as much from Jeff’s incoherent and illiterate posts.

        Where I lived in the States I had no personal experience with theft, graffiti, vandalism, and out of control alcohol related mayhem. Can’t say the same for New Zealand, unfortunately.

        My husband is a successful entrepreneur, so money is not really a problem for us, but we resent paying exorbitant prices for nearly everything, just to support the corrupt, inept and greedy business practices of the locals and overseas companies that know what they can get away with trading in New Zealand. They realize how gullible the typical Kiwi can be. I can tell you, though, from personal experience that building in Auckland is extremely expensive. Do your homework; there’s lots to be found on the internet about sky high council fees and general building costs..

        I can’t say you’ll be disappointed when you get here. After all, I think New Zealand can be a paradise if you’re a bogan, a scam artist, if you have little interest in culture beyond rugby, and of course, if you’re racist. Be warned though, if you’re looking to take white flight, Auckland is not your kind of place. There’s a significant population of Chinese, Indians, Filipinos, Pacific Islanders, etc. Perhaps you thought New Zealand, and specifically Auckland, is like a better Britain stuck in a time warp, instead of the great Pacific melting pot that it is? Never mind, you can always take the recourse of so many Brits that find themselves stuck: Just tell everyone back home how much you’re loving your life, and try to make them envious by sending lots of beach photos. It will help you delude yourself into believing you’ve improved your quality of life.


      • White supremacists & racists like Jeff will probably need to relocate to different planet or galaxy altogether based on his comments on Chinese & Indians. Let the summer begin and then you will see everyone turning into blotchy Red-Indians. Isn’t that the colour of the skin everyone dies for in NZ and later in their lives spend more $$$’s towards skin cancer.


      • Valerie ,as Admin mentions you may not be able to place more than one structure on the property,the compliance regulations are incredibly restrictive and council permit/consent fees are prohibitive.I don’t know where the land is but unless your relative is incredibly wealthy I would guess the land is located very far from an area most people would want to live,prime properties which are subdividable are snapped up by developers for way more than equivalent property would cost in the U.S .Building labor is available here at reasonable prices ,building materials are 40 to 50 % more expensive that the U.S and many are of poor quality.The material cost of building anything makes it not economically viable in many cases .
        I lived 25 years in the U.S and I understand that your relative has been away for 19 years .They can not be aware of what it is to live here now ,it’s not the same place ,returning here has been the biggest mistake of my life ,I came here with a healthy amount of savings and have invested and managed to hang on to my money,socially this place is a wasteland,I have always been a positive friendly and outgoing person ,in three years I have not made a single friend here and miss my social group and friends in California.
        If you really feel compelled to move here try it first for six months to a year and keep your options open in the U.S ,try to live like a local here not a tourist,take an interest in budgeting,ie compare how much things cost here as opposed to where you live ,even if you are not working pick a place you would likely work and go drive there a few times in commute traffic,read other people’s posts on this site.Goodluck


  58. I have lived in nz all my life 63 years although I have spent time in the UK and Aussi it was great growing up here but now it is a nanny state I can see why our suicide rate is high people are bored you can’t do much with out breaking the law kids are not aloud to fly toy planes in the park or any public areas 20 years ago nz was a great place not now changing fast not for the better.


    • I agree, the pioneering spirit seems to be being socially engineered OUT of NZ.
      The curious part is: why are immigrants being “excluded” ? I believe that the “pioneering” spirit is not PC therefore is not what NZ is about these days.
      To immigrate to a foreign land requires a “pioneering spirit”, NZ is no longer interested in this “pioneering spirit”.


  59. In response to Fred, i’m with you all the way, I know exactly how you feel, I am so trapped here and miserable, I sometimes think of ending it all but have grandchildren I love dearly so would never do that but each day is the same, so boring


  60. Well every 1 here seems to experience d. Is job sector is to bad in NZ. I am a skilled hand I want to know will I be able to get a nice skilled job. business with 200000$ can earn 7000$ monthly. Need advice as I am planning for NZ.


    • No Matter how skilled you are if u get $3000 a month job here consider yourself the most luckiest man. i am living here from last 8 years 7 years working in IT and still working on $3000 a month. don’t waste your time and mo
      ney consider some developed country which value your skill. once you come here you will be trapped here and waste you precious few years of life until you escaped from this country


  61. Thank you for this story. I certainly agree with you and feel you. i lived in the states for 13 yrs. and when i moved to Ch.Ch. i was literally shocked. i couldn’t believe that nz is considered a developed country. I can tell you many stories about my life in NZ but then after living in NZ for 9 yrs i moved to Australia and then got a very good job offer in China on a contract for 5 yrs. I am really lucky to turn off the light and leave nz. But i should say i have a very lovely Kiwi wife who has been very supportive and understand the hard life in nz. in fact, she was the one who used to constantly advise me to leave nz as soon as i finished my phd. in Wellington. a week after i finish my phd. we left for Australia for four yrs. it’s not bad in Australia but also taxes are high and nowadays very hard to find a permanent position. all what u mentioned about nz are 100% right. if i had stayed there i would have wasted 4 yrs of my hard work at uni. for nothing even when i was at uni. working on phd i could not find any jobs related to my major and i ended up doing low jobs such as cleaning, receptionist, machine operators just to make ends meet.it must have been mentally hard on you especially when you come from USA. i believe that you will much happier once u go back to the states. all the best in your future endeavours.


  62. Thanks u all. Actually scenery u r not going to eat year round . u need nice work to do related to ur skill. What about Australia /Canada.


  63. Students r mad here for studying their. Students making suside. Can’t make up their living. U now studies here in India r best. Doctors/engg. Maximum from here. Every corner u will find agent for studies to NZ, Australia/Canada. I do not why students ts r so keen to go their. They should study in India & qualify for PR on education experience basis. The vias card is in pocket when ever u feel like go & come, can choose any country. My personal advice to students do not waste time money. We at age of 40 cannot have much options.


    • maybe all you people shouldn’t have moved to NZ to start with. You move there expecting what you had in your original homeland which begs the question of why move to start with?? You make no attempt to learn the ways and expect things to go the way you want, NZ has never had great infrastructure, wages or housing, if you were too stupid to realise this before you decided to go then maybe you should take a look in the mirror and realise you have no one to blame but yourself and before you say anything I’m not even from there, but I know how to research and maybe if you people who claim your homeland is so much better learnt aswel (doesn’t say much for your education systems…..) you wouldn’t be in that situation.


      • Tell us more about your own situation joel. What keeps you in New Zealand? .

        NZ has never had great infrastructure, wages or housing

        Thanks for clearing that up, what never?! But don’t those three factors define “First World Country”?

        Here’s what NewZealandNow.govt.nz tells prospective migrants from the UK, do you think the country is being actively miss-sold to migrants? there’s nothing about New Zealand being a developing country

        “Overall, it’ll probably cost you much the same to live in New Zealand as it does to live in the UK”

        “…overall the cost of living in New Zealand is comparable to what you’ll find in any OECD country”

        “You’ll find we offer the same sort of consumer goods you’re used to, at competitive prices. Costs for imported items like cars, electrical and computer equipment and petrol are similar to what you’d find in Australia or other similar countries”

        “Housing in New Zealand is as varied as our people. New Zealand homes are generally built to make the most of the light and the outdoors. We prize an ‘indoor-outdoor flow’ because it is ideal for barbecues and summer living! Historically we have built standalone houses, made with a timber frame and either timber or brick veneer cladding, but as cities become more populated, apartments and multiple unit houses have become more popular”

        “You’ll be able to choose a home you’ll all be comfortable in, and you’ll enjoy excellent healthcare and public facilities”

        Compare those statements to these:

        NZ housing standards ’15 years behind Europe’ (3News.co.nz April 2015) “Here’s a question as we come into winter: What do you expect your average electricity bill to be? A couple of hundred dollars a month? Maybe you’ve got a big house that’s hard to heat and it ends up costing $300 to $400 a month. Tonight, Campbell Live wanted to show viewers a new three-bedroom home that when completed, will be New Zealand most energy efficient house ever; a house claimed to be so efficient, the electricity bills are predicted to be nothing. The big question: why aren’t all new homes built to this standard?”

        Rental properties face minimum standards rules (Stuff.co.nz June 2015): “Rental properties will have to meet a set of minimum standards under rules to be unveiled by the Government next month…The signal comes in the wake of a coroner’s finding last week that the death of Emma-Lita Bourne from a brain haemorrhage could partly be blamed on the poor condition of the state house she lived in. The family had been provided with a heater but could not afford to put it on. However, a full warrant of fitness has been rejected by the Government as too difficult to police and requiring regular “rechecks” that would hike compliance costs.”

        NZ’s health system $1 billion worse off than six years ago (CTU June 2015). A shortfall of $245 million in the health budget for 2015/2016 will mean that many New Zealanders will find it harder and harder to get the care they need when they need it. “The Government’s overall priority of reducing expenditure and policies such as the planned tax cuts are in effect being paid for in New Zealanders’ health services and other public services”

        Brutal health cuts confirmed, cruical services suffer (Scoop.co.nz July 2015): Chronic underfunding means the health service budget has been slashed by £1.75 billion since 2010. ” DHBs are facing a financial double whammy, confronted by rising costs – due to factors such as cost pressures, demographic changes and an ageing population – at the same time they are being told to make savings of millions of dollars. Put the two together and you no longer have a health sector with the ability to provide Kiwis with high quality safe patient care, where and when it is needed”

        When some reality and honesty makes its way into the government’s official emigration websites we’ll close down this site. So far, we’ve been going since 2009 and are likely to continue for another 6 years yet.


      • “maybe all you people shouldn’t have moved to NZ to start with.”

        If there had been information proffered such as E2NZ brings up when I was contemplating NZ, I would have seriously reconsidered. The problem arises when the information [research] available from immigration sites and the government does not accurately reflect the reality, it is difficult to make an educated assessment. If you look very cynically at the information, you could presume that not all of the glowing accounts are true, but I don’t think that very many people are wanting to discount “official” data and recommendations. It is only when after some first hand experience that you learn how slanted [false] the information is. Truth is hard to come by, especially when it is being so actively misrepresented.

        I do look at the decision that I’ve made and feel as though I’ve been had by a huckster. The NZ sites are not much more trustworthy than a used car salesman.

        I don’t think that any migrant moves somewhere hoping it is terrible. This site represents those that have made a good faith effort [and perhaps believed the hype] and made the move and are severely disappointed with the disparity between what was represented and reality. The only hope is that this divergent opinion will give prospective migrants an alternate view and maybe spare them the pain.


      • Hi Joel

        I have to admit I was a bit naive to have emigrated to New Zealand without it visiting in the first place. It was never my intention to come here but my stepdad insisted it was so good here apparently. At the time my partner and I had a happy life in Belgium a heaven compared to here..which I didn’t realize of course back then. My husband was suffering from asthma and could not stay in the overpopulated and heavily polluted city. We had to move for his health. Also I had heard from my stepdad that the air should be so clean in new Zealand so we thought why not give it a go since he promised us to help where he could.

        I have traveled my whole life basically since I was born , mainly in the States and Europe even in the middle east where I also worked. I never have had a racist problem or let say any real problem with people in those countries. I was basically accepted everywhere even in Palestine… and it was always easy to make new friends anywhere. For people in the west we somehow get a picture from New Zealand as a similar developed nation as any western country and so it would never cross our minds that it is actually not. I was never fortunate enough to read these stories and so we have lost all our life savings in New Zealand and are struggling to get out now. Like we did hear about places like Dubai and Singapore being expensive but we’d just never thought it would be this bad.. And Yes we should have done more research. We felt sort of pressured by my stepdad cause he got us into it and was paying the permit. Not blaming him but we would have never come here if it wasn’t for him and we would have been $50000 richer…

        I am very happy to have found this website and thank everybody for participating and of course the moderator now so at least I can warn other people not to make the same mistake we have made to emigrate here and for New Zealanders not to have babies while they are teenagers but to get a working holiday in a developed nation so they can have a fair chance in life like we have in the west. I really feel sorry for the kiwi’s here. They are just born in to this shit and maybe don’t even realize how much better their lives could have been if they moved out before having kids. I would like to urge them to search for possibilities over the internet. thank you


        • How long ago to you come to New Zealand. I am not on a high income but find living here just as god if not better than other western countries. We enjoy the outdoors and would never have the standard of living we have if living in Europe. eg….sking in winter. beaches tramping travel around NZ great outdoor life in the summer. I educated my children at private schools and it was a sacrifice to do so but it is manageable. The South Island is more friendly and maybe that is where many of you need to go. There are many immigrant communities there who mix with those born in New Zealand. I feel sad reading these articles and maybe you have not met the right peoples or that your expectations are far too high. In 2015 New Zealand in a vibrant country with world class standards. Some peoples just do not appreciate thisl


          • Maybe that’s because it’s not a “vibrant country with world class standards” ? That definition usually applies to the countries migrants leave behind. When people say “NZ is like [insert country] 30 years ago” they’re not referring to its quaintness.

            Read what British migrant jackiejo said in August:

            We moved to NZ 2012 and returned 2014 – I would not recommend anyone moving there – it was the worst experience of our lives
            So in brief:- essentially its a 3rd world county in many respects.
            Although they have some free healthcare – you have to pay every time you see a GP/nurse – lots of stuff is not available on prescription – so you have to pay full price for the medication – which can be very expensive
            Housing – renting is very expensive – property is much higher than the UK
            No central heating – houses are very damp and mouldy – no matter what you do
            No double glazing or insulation – winters are unbearable – even though they are not as cold as UK
            Utilities more expensive
            Tax – 33% from $0 onwards, salary and savings
            Food – about 3 x more than UK
            Flights back to UK about 3rd more in money
            Choice – very little even in the cities
            Jobs – honestly they only want non NZ people to fill jobs they cant recruit to – so generally the jobs no one else wants – can be quite racist – we had we don’t want you pommies taking our jobs
            If you lose your job – you are stuck in NZ because you have to have nothing before you get any help from NZ – so its very scary.
            30 years behind the rest of the world
            Loads of people work in NZ until a very old age because they have only just implemented contributory pensions there
            In the first year – my daughter was mugged and someone tried to pick my husbands pocket – so we felt very unsafe there.
            School are mediocre – you have to buy your own books etc. and they ask for a yearly contribution to the school usually $250-500 per child
            It ends up being just an existence and a lonely one at that.
            Lots of people get stuck in NZ because they cant afford to come back to UK – which must be awful
            Don’t believe all of the hype of recruiters, conventions, TV shows – take note of things like this – they are mostly accurate – its an expensive in many ways mistake to make especially if you are dragging your family across the other side of the world!

            BTW, skiing in winter isn’t that much of a novelty and definitely isn’t something unique to NZ 🙂


          • The scenery is the only thing NZ has got going for it and as the Kiwi’s must be painfully aware of this, they keep going on and on and on about it. Ironically enough, the scenery is also the only thing they didn’t have a hand in themselves. I rest my case.


          • Some peoples just do not appreciate this.
            Yes, I am one of the peoples that have been abroad [ME, subcontinent, Asia] and have lived in 1st world countries. I know what makes or doesn’t make world class standards and sadly I believe that statement in regards to NZ is delusional.


          • Hi Hilary ,

            If you have the money to afford yes. But then there is still the sense of isolation. Because for sure most kiwi’s leave you out of “their club” . Happen to have lived on both of the island and have travelled almost anywhere in NZ. And in most news papers I read the same story about housing crisis in Auckland ,Christchurch and Queenstown where the house prices will be the most expensive from all western countries !! Never thought about that before moving here !

            I can find myself in all immigrant stories here and I can confirm it is for sure true in every disgusting little detail. Also my husband agrees with all of you.
            It just amazes me that you kiwi’s accept to live with these burdens like non isolated homes , skyrocket high energy and house prices , cold damp houses . Have you any idea what you can get for that money in an western country ?!

            The average rental price per week would be 700 dollars per week just to leave water light and so on out of it. In an western country you pay this per month and you get even better quality ! well isolated low energy costs , better low costs in everything you buy perhaps only the petrol be higher and some cars..

            New Zealand is fine if you are very rich and like to be isolated and to be away from it all. But for the hard working middle class taxpayer it would be best if you come to new Zealand on a camping trip. But only the conservation campsite ones because all other one will also be very expensive ! rent a campervan and drive on the left side of the road and you’ll love it. People will be friendly to the tourist most of the time because they bring the money in ! Only when you steal their jobs they will become rude with you.

            Glad you love it here and have the money to afford to live here. If you are a kiwi it’s nice to have all your family and friends around you eye ? Perhaps when you meet an foreigner.. just invite them over…



    • Normally posts such as Liz D’s would be deleted for breaching the (Kool-Aid) comments guidelines, however her was too amusing to let go.

      Everyone deserves a bit of humor in their day, thanks for providing it to our readers 😀


      • Why is it that most of the people in Public Relations …
        only make the case for them, not to be in that field?
        “Mass Communication” indeed …


    • This site seems to be based mostly on the daily NZ headlines but you want it shut down and the owners hauled before the courts. Why. For being a news aggregate site, or for daring to support an alternative view to your own? I think you’ve been fed a diet of propaganda for so long you can’t face up to the truth any more and are terrified by it


      • This site is not based in New Zealand, neither are any of the admin team (all of whom have either been migrants or students in New Zealand).

        We do republish a lot of current events stories, but seldom in isolation and always in context. Probably in the same way that the overseas press does.

        E2NZ.org also provides a safe place for people (especially migrants) to express themselves without being told to ‘F*** off back home if they don’t like it’. That is so rarely available in New Zealand that people sometimes find the freedom…intoxicating.


    • I doubt that Liz ever learned about Voltaire in the New Zealand schools. However, his quotation that “those who can make you believe absurdities can also make you commit atrocities” is quite appropriate. If you believe the absurdities about how great New Zealand is then you can surely commit atrocities such as persecuting people for speech that you dislike.

      People such as Liz who are incapable of forming cogent arguments instead prefer to use the tools of despots and shut down anyone with whom they disagree. The New Zealand (in)justice system has a proclivity for trying to shut down those who expose corruption and wrongdoing. If New Zealand is so great, then why must it persecute dissenters?


      • SafefromNewZealand said

        “those who can make you believe absurdities can also make you commit atrocities”

        Liz obviously didn’t ever learn about Voltaire in school.


    • Good luck with getting a job when you finish training as a nurse given that more than 50% of new grad nurses cannot get a job in nursing. And good luck avoiding the horrendous culture of bullying in healthcare/nursing here if you do actually get a job. And good luck with that anti-free speech attitude – one of the main reasons for negative comments about the Land of the Long White Cloud.


      • @OveritNZ, Liz’s comment was deleted after she was banned. One of the unpublished posts she made was:

        “L.D. – Mintbubbles@****.com”

        Please enlighten me on why you deem yourself to be the ultimate authority on New Zealand? Did you ever live here? If so, where? In Auckland? I personally live rural, it’s much nicer. Especially while I have two weeks holiday and “time on my hands” to enjoy it. You are obviously fixated on New Zealand to the point of obsession. Do you have an illness of some sort? Or are you limited in your physical mobility and therefore have plenty of time to aid and abet this racist site? On another topic now..There are at least 7 models besides IQ to measure intelligence, did you know that? I’m guessing not, since Admin and readers regularly refer to Kiwi’s “IQ”. I can tell by your posts that you lack emotional intelligence, do you have Aspergers?

        Unfortunately L.D. is more likely to contribute to the horrendous culture of bullying in healthcare/nursing than avoid it.


        • Lovely bedside manner.
          I love the drawing of the conclusion that unless you LOVE NZ, you must be sick/ill, have a disease, or are disabled.
          Then the ignorant accusation of being racist.
          I feel dumber having just read “L.D. – Mintbubbles@****.com”’s post.


  64. I am so, so sad to read the above comments….
    At the same time- extreamly relieved.
    It’s my dream to live in NZ. Well, not any more 😦
    It is true that the message reaching UK is portraying NZ as green heaven. Mostly.
    So the above text and comments below it are much appreciated 🙂
    I wouldn’t like to find my beautiful, young family stranded and struggling.


    Thank you Admin and all that bothered to share their stories x


  65. I think you have it mostly correct.

    But I think you will find most people really struggle here to pay the bills.

    We are still a young country that is only just starting to deal with real world issues. We need to put a public transport system in and rethink our housing configuration to activate our towns and cities.
    We would love to have greater variety in food and fast food, have more expendable income.

    In my view we need another 4m of population to make anything viable

    Wish you the best in working out weather to stay or not.

    Our country can be a bit boring


    • Andrew,

      Always a bit curious when the ‘still a young country’ line is trotted out.

      When do you think NZ became a country??

      Treaty of Waitangi – 1840

      NZ granted Dominion Status – 1907
      Gallipoli – 1915

      When it joined the UN – 1945
      When it ratified the statute of westminster (1931) – 1947

      What was ‘taught’ in NZ schools??


      Singapore, for example only became an independent country in 1965 yet has managed to develop a top notch public transport system.


      • Excellent comment Brian. Singapore is light years ahead of New Zealand in development, finance, education and social structures. NZ looks positively third world by comparison.


        • What’s Singapore’s population density compared to NZ? One of NZs issues is enough people in one place to make businesses viable and towns vibrant. A lot of our population is spread out and hard to make public transport stack.
          We need a rethink is how we build our cities BUT I agree still backward thinking has left us in this situation.


  66. The reason why New Zealand will never come anywhere close to Singapore is its love affair with ‘Eurocentricity’ and ‘Superiority Propaganda’. Funny thing is 99% of the goods that kiwis consume is made in ‘not Europe’, however owing to the virtue ‘dumbness’ still prefer europeans while hiring workers. Saddens me to death when I see a qualified, non white migrant working on gas stations while the white kiwis ( barely high school pass) sitting and quaking like lame ducks at the top echelon of the corporate and civil governance. They keep quaking their propaganda to the clueless flock of kiwis while the world moves on to better things.

    In the end note, this place will never be first world country, unless and until the fat cats are kicked out and really qualified migrants are given their due respect. This country is a colonial cesspit, filled with vile people who are Xenophobic and racists. This ought to change.


    • Singapore almost sounds like the perfect place to live in a lot of ways. It’s amazing how they keep their crime rate down (actual punishment) and would consider living there if it weren’t for a few issues. Absolutely hilarious when kiwis accuse them of human rights abuses in the area of punishment, then wonder why NZ is getting more and more violent and dangerous.


      • Criminals only understand the language of caning – which I think Singapore uses generously and in turn keeps the crime rate low….very very low.


        • Yep. I love it. I remember when those guys from I forgot where decided to vandalize some stuff and got a nice caning and some jail time. The keyboard warrior kiwis were howling about how inhumane it was and how primitive Singapore is. My family and I were loving it. If only we had the same system here.


    • The Legatum Institute is a division of a private investment company based in Dubai. It uses metrics supplied by countries such as education and health as a measure of prosperity rather than GDP. Any index that places New Zealand above Singapore for prosperity has authenticity issues. That it should be cited by the NZ government on a site to attract migrants, and is based on data it itself supplies, also raises questions about authenticity and bias. The index probably still doesn’t include metrics that New Zealand has poor results for: sustainability, environmental degradation, and contribution to combating climate change.

      Household income may be a better prosperity indicator and median incomes describe societal inequity better than mean averages, as it is not skewed by gains and abnormalities in the extreme ends of the ranks. The median weekly hourly earnings for New Zealand is $21.94 NZD for the June 2014 quarter. Based on 2013 data for median incomes New Zealand (11) falls below non-European countries Australia (4), USA (6), Canada (7) South Korea (8) and Kuwait (9) N.B. this is BEFORE deductions for taxes and other social contributions.

      OECD statistics for annual median equivalence disposable income places New Zealand 16th, below non-European countries USA (4) Australia (5) and Canada (7).

      New Zealand has 270,000 children living in poverty, the highest rate of domestic violence in the OECD and one of the worst youth suicide rates. New Zealand’s suicide deaths in 2015 were the highest since records began.

      The OECD also compiles the Safest Countries in the World report, New Zealand doesn’t even make it into the list of top 10 small countries. Australia is in 5th place in the top 10 big countries, and is ranked 12th overall – something that many Kiwis will find hard to accept because of the constant negative press that country receives in New Zealand. New Zealand languishes in 41st place overall for safety, with an assault rate of 839 per 100,000 people and a safety score of 112, far and away higher than Australia’s assault rate of 306 and safety score of 78. More here Overall, New Zealand has the 102nd highest assault rate out of a total of 107 countries.

      One doesn’t see metrics like that on ‘New Zealand now’, neither do they ‘make it’ to the Legatum Prosperity Index.


      • In New Zealand, there is a lot of deception that goes on regarding the number of people employed, and the amount that they actually earn. On the surface, the unemployment rate at the moment is given at 6%, with the average wage rate at $29.29 per hour. But, the realities are very different. At present, according to Labour Market Statistics, there are 3,638,000 people of working age in New Zealand, but only 64.5% of these people are actually in employment (1,830,000 people). This means that 35.5% of the New Zealand workforce, are not working.

        The earnings are equally as deceptive, in 2013, in a proposal put to the government it was revealed that there were 84,800 people on minimum wage (then $13.50 per hour), and a further 221,000 people on between $13.50 and $15.00 per hour. This equates to approximately 17% of all the people working still living in poverty, and requiring government assistance. It should also be noted that many of these lower earning individuals will be earning less than they would receive on a benefit, giving them no incentive to participate in the workforce whatsoever.

        It doesn’t take too much to work out that if only two thirds of the country’s workforce is actually working, and out of that 17% of them still require government assistance due to low earnings, then nearly 50% of the working population of New Zealand is getting some kind of government handouts either in the form of a benefit, or supplemental assistance of some kind. This is shown very clearly in the way the New Zealand government spends taxpayer money.

        In total, in 2014/2015, social security and welfare cost New Zealand taxpayers $28.2 BILLION. This is a MASSIVE level of wealth redistribution, with vast sums of money changing hands. It is the single largest area of government spending in New Zealand, costing nearly the same as the next two largest areas combined: health ($14.7 billion), and education ($13.5 billion). Of the $72.2 billion collected by the government ($66.6 billion of which are from taxes), welfare represents approximately 39% of ALL spending.



  67. Hi all ,

    here in the library I met the average NZ bloke… young unemployed white guy’s talking to themselves saying.. I will beat the Asians up and expressing more hate against Asians. Perhaps jealous of the Asians because they make a whole lot more cash then him right ?! And so they are a lot smarter !!

    Sorry to bring you the negative news but thought you’d better know before moving here. So you know what and who you’ll be dealing with and so you can prepare yourself mentally !

    have a great day.


    • These lame benefit thieves can only work in groups because they don’t have the balls to confront one on one and more importantly do anything productive, they stray miles away from any hard working job. What these bunch of dumb-wits dont understand is that their dole is directly & indirectly coming from the hardworking taxpayers who are both locals and large proportion of them are migrants.


      • ah you are indeed quite right about that ! I really hope they are an minority in NZ society. Also have seen really hard working kiwi’s no offence for them though.


        • When I was younger I was doing greenhouse work and we had a lot of seasonal applications. EVERY SINGLE ONE was lazy, constantly slacked off and broke rules, incredibly deceitful like lying about when break time started so they could get a few extra minutes, taking naps when our boss had to go out, the list goes on. Guess who was the only one who worked hard without complaining? The one Chinese guy lol.


    • Where was this? I’d like to get my hands on such kiwis.
      It’s a common view among trash here, though they all try to say Asians are corrupt and only think of cheating the system to get ahead. It’s as you say, they’re extremely jealous when they see someone who has more than them and rather than look in the mirror they instead opt to abuse and hurt the person.


  68. Whining ? you are told just to shut up and except an miserable life here…(at least for most people) Just another view at the newspaper this week that 200 little children died of abuse neglect and so on !!
    Never seen any news like that in an western country and if it did it would be condemned greatly. We have got an organised social system that would prevent situations like that !
    What a shame New Zealand. And who really cares about these issues ? Well I do ! I would not ever want my child to be confronted with any of those crimes on school or anywhere. Horrifying !

    Stand up for your rights , demand well insulated homes so your children won’t die from it. Like it did the past year.. (check the newspapers) Get double glazed windows so you won’t be paying 12000 dollars per year for nothing. And get the educational system on to world standards. Yes it would mean learning from nations that do better then you. But who cares if your nation would improve greatly from it ?!
    Get better safety on the work place and tourism industry so you won’t scare more tourists of ! Invest in those things to get an better life for everybody here and you will improve your economy and attract even more tourists and immigrants that would want to stay and kiwi’s that want to stay instead of leaving to Australia all the time…..

    Look around man .. you deserve better then this !!


    • Kiwis won’t stand up for their rights because the powers that be, and the rest of society will not back them up! No one here wants to get into trouble and that ‘s why so many things go unreported and unchanged. Everything here eventually comes back to income, and the almost paranoid fears Kiwis have about losing it. They say nothing to stay safe. I like to speak out, and have paid the price for it on several occasions.


      • Liability issues in NZ;
        *Having an opinion [perhaps running contrary to the “consensus”] and backing it up with facts and a sound argument.
        *Being honest and expecting others [in NZ] to be also.
        *Having modern and current knowledge of methods used in business/industry elsewhere.
        *A pro-active work ethic. [Showing up, showing up on time, staying til work done/specified leaving time, using; initiative, problem solving, time and cost saving techniques, time management….]

        Funnily enough, these attributes are highly sought after in other parts of the 1st world.


      • Couldn’t agree more ,it’s so difficult for spirited intelligent N.Zers ,this is s revenge culture ,people here on this Island know and fear social isolation.If a kiwi feels you have stepped out of line according to their skewed world view the first punishment inflicted on the perceived offender will be social isolation .To achieve this the Kiwi will slander the offender in anyway they can ,this can be achieved in many ways ,if you have a nice car ,house etc and they can’t see your source of revenue they will cast suspicion on your income stream with unfounded insinuations of tax avoidance ,drug trafficking etc ,you will be accused of alcohol abuse ,sexual deviance and any other scum they can scratch off the bottom of the barrel ,you will never now why people won’t associate with you as all this information is passed while you are not present and you will not be given a chance to defend yourself as the majority of kiwis are nasty spineless cowards and will do anything to avoid having to confront the person they are sabotaging .My neighbours don’t talk to me because I have a slight American accent after 23 years residing in California,I have it on good information that they constantly talk about me ,they stare into my windows and back yard any chance they can get ,my movements are monitored and one neighbour rushes to her large picture window to watch me come and go from my house,this is not a poor area and it’s bizarre ,anyway selling the house in Jan and moving to an apt above my workplace in a commercial area ,no more unfriendly N.Z suburbia for me


        • I found the neighbours in some of the suburbs i stayed in exactly the same very odd. One of my first jobs i had after a weeks i heard a local (Kiwi) was in line for it and i was to be given the boot. Only one out of the workforce and give him his due he was a Kiwi tipped me off and told me they never had the guts to tell me.

          True enough when the time came a fortnight or so later i was told they had to let me go. To say i gave them a piece of my mind was an understatement. They didnt seem to neither care or seem remotely bothered. I had barely been there a year. Most in fact all future employers were all a nightmare near enough and no it wasnt me i was simply a white english speaking immigrant trying to have a fair go in their country. I could write a book on that place just so glad i saw the light this site is a must to future victims who tread on that strange land. All the best.


  69. thanks moderator for posting this article ! It is really encouraging to us we are not alone in this battle here.
    I would like to get in touch with this lady. Can you tell us in which group it was posted ? thanks


  70. I’m glad I found this site. I am American and emigrated to NZ, lasted 12 months and decided I cannot stand the place and people, so decided to return. I was lured there by the advertisement of an amazing lifestyle and a friendly small-town attitude. I was very disappointed. So many issues where do I begin?! First of all work was the problem. I am a highly qualified accounts manager (which I was working as in Chicago before I decided to move). I have a BA Honors degree from Harvard which is normally regarded highly. I was disappointed to achieve only a junior sales position at a company in Wellington. Is it really fair that kiwi’s with some shitty degree from a university no-one has ever heard of are in a more senior position and command a higher salary? Perhaps that’s why they seemed to resort to sort of bullying tactics in the workplace. I have a weight problem. Its something that I am aware of. There was absolutely no sympathy or help from my colleagues around me who clearly didn’t realize the difficulty this gave me and I was often labelled as “lazy” because of this. I am so hard-working and feel like I do everything in the office without help from anyone. I tried pointing this out to my boss and was told that “Kiwi’s tend to seem more laid back at times but do work hard”. What an answer! I couldn’t believe it.
    Health and safety is almost non-existent, I cant believe that if an accident occurs there is no fair way of getting compensation from the person or person’s responsible. To be paid only 80% of a salary by ACC is not justice! Everything seems to close early, late night shopping doesn’t exist and in general I just found the whole place to be dead! Definitely not the buzzing excitement and city lights of Chicago. Fashion doesn’t exist either. It’s like someone turned the clock back 30 years on their outfits.
    The country hardly seems to have a military. God knows what would happen in a terrorist attack, most probably the US would be called on to save them. I’m hoping they would get a refusal. Be aware anyone particularly from the great land that is the mighty USA that it is not what you think!


    • My partner used to do a lot in fashion industry and more often than not she is just shocked with the cheap stuff that is sold here. The designer labels don’t have much creativity either, the local designers seem to have limited creative talent too. NZ has been the only place where I came across mullets, 80’s hairstyles (especially women) and outdated fashion sense too.

      There’s hardly one place my partner walks into where she isn’t complimented & questioned about her styling (clothes, accessories etc) and the only explanation she ever gives is…..none of it is from NZ :).

      i’m not surprised why GST is being imposed on online purchases now, government just wanted everyone to fit into one uniform – sorry we wont be part of it!


      • glad you have the choice to get out ! It does make you feel you are stuck in time a really long time ago here doesn’t it ?! Even the songs on the radio are mainly seventies ,eighties and nineties !! hahah


    • People come to New Zealand for lifestyle choices rather than being able to slot into a similar employment from once they had in their country of Origin. The numbers arriving do not liar. We now need an additional 150,000 houses to be built to accommodate new migrants. While New Zealand is not the best Country in the World to live. We rate up there in a lot of areas . Don’t forget we are a small country and we are very dependant on countries with strong economies to buy our products. So far tourism has now overtaken Dairy as our greatest money earner. You cannot compare our country with large countries like the States, Australia UK or China. They have been around for centuries and had time to evolve into strong economies. I’m a proud New Zealander. I love the diversity and cultural blend we have now. It’s exciting times and already you can just about go anywhere and dine at any restaurant you desire. Our Universities are good quality, we are evolving with Unitary plans to build our Cities to accommodate large population. We can’t please everyone’s taste to how the Cities should be designed and built but we are all part of planning and designing our cities of the future, Have any of you tried to join a local sporting club, go to Marae where they have a open day, join a local RSA or Fishing Club? I have and have made a lot of new friends with different nationalities


      • Jerry Davis,

        Interesting comments, however I disagree on one point– Australia as a nation state, is only a few years older than NZ and it was settled by Europeans about two generations earlier than NZ, so the two countries are indeed, comparable.


  71. this was in the central library.. Christchurch .often full with unemployed guy’s mainly. Please don’t confuse them with the backpackers who start their journey there ! They are mainly unaware of the problems that are here..
    Not sure a fight will solve their problem though.. If not for Asia , China … New Zealand wouldn’t be able to exist !! Forgot to tell them that . Indeed wouldn’t be surprised if the benefit they get comes from the hardest working Asians around here ! Racism doesn’t solve anything.. but ruins the atmosphere in town for everybody white and black alike !!
    It’s not only there.. I’d never seen so many people driving around in an city the whole day as in Christchurch. Coffee places packed as we talk. And they are telling us there is enough work and opportunity for immigrants ? mainly new Zealanders I see hanging around all day … And I’m talking thousands.. I don’t know their situation but I have just never seen this in My country in Europa or America during day time. Not even in the crisis !! So what in the world is going on here ?


    • Not to forget the verbal diarrhea most of them have…just say “hello” and then you will see never ending conversation which surprisingly is equated to higher productivity 🙂


      • I grew up partly in the USA and so I have a slightly an American accent which kiwi’s don’t seem to like .. So I can imagine just a bit of the racism you American’s must have suffered here. I am happy you are safe back home Cassandra ! You must be thrilled !


  72. You can get an working holiday visa if under 35 years old for most countries. Just check the ministry of foreign affairs Canada for details. About a year ago it would benefit you if you are NZ resident but that has changed now. The only thing you need is to find a job and you’re in ! It ‘s easy to get a working visa as well !
    There is an job list on the ministries of foreign affairs immigration website. Good luck ! What I’ve seen many jobs there ! They really need immigrants !


  73. I am very sorry to hear that Jeff ! And they deserve so much better because they build this nation up with their own hands ! What I have understood from most people I met that Australia would be even cheaper to live than NZ. I have heard the living costs would be cheaper there and what I’ve seen over the internet is that you can get more for your money when you buy an house. Just heard another story recently from one of the many immigrants that want to live in Australia. The Boy went to University here an had a awful time .. students destroying each other laptops because of the competition going on there and so on .. No wonder they want to go to Australia as soon as they can ! And then not to speak of the extreme cold weather conditions the students have to put up with in the south ..no wander everybody wants to stay drunk all the time ! he said it was colder inside their house then out ! perhaps the baby boomers should consider retirement in an cheaper and nicer country like Chile is very popular under the Belgians.. and quite cheap.


  74. I will also put this in regards to New Zealand, the Dentist is not cheap, for example to have you teeth cleaned, its straight $140 and when it comes to cosmetic dental, its even way more expensive


  75. Family values do not feature highly in New Zealand, its every man woman and child for themself. This is reflected in the country’s appallingly high youth suicide rate, and high rates of child abuse and domestic violence – three things that New Zealand leads the world in.

    That right.I and my boyfriend Nigel people NZ had been Vietnam for long time and us hope have baby but I not pregnant.Later one week ago US come to NZ I know pregnant 3 or 4 week Yes I really happy happy because I’m 32 years old and this is my first baby but I worry because I bleed.From when I pregnat ,after I miscarried my boyfriend always violent to me and everytime he always Using his body on top of me a person of his hand give my mounth silenceI could not breathe and do each time he never leave wound on my person

    The most fear,Using his body on top of my boddy give pillow of my face and he told to me”die,die ,die”
    I can not breathe
    I tried to escape him and I become people oever stay NZ a month when he called the police to arrest me was when Nigel suspected I was pregnant second.

    And I told the police to please help me and my children with fairness
    but NZ police told me that they doubt I want to stay in NZ
    they did not help me and I returned VN

    My visa is limted visa so when I got visa it’s mean I can born baby or marry and I can’t stay NZ and I must go back VN If I want stay NZ when I and Nigel been NZ so why why why I do not marry

    I just want they can help me and let me know Cause my child my children what dead
    Why my baby die later after Nigel sat on my stomach and one hand twisted my leg up
    a hand to my mouth
    I can not breathe


  76. Admin feel free to publish this, its from my experience in living in New Zealand

    It is no secret that I have lived in New Zealand for more than 20 years along with my parents. But this is my experience with New Zealand:


    Don’t be surprised if you’re placed on the waiting list for surgery, New Zealand has a serious to chronic shortage when it comes to surgeons, even nurses in the Lower Hutt Hospital are being made to administer Chemotherapy because of a serious shortage of doctors, if you have a condition like arthritis and other delbilitating condition be prepared to be put in a ‘Waiting List’ and wait for more than 5-10 years for surgery.

    The Doctor is also quite expensive, imagine paying $40 for the doctors fee and then $30+ for medicine

    When you need the ER (Emergency Room) in a hospital be prepared to wait very long, one time I had to go to the hospital for a severe Asthma attack I waited at least 6 hours before being admitted.

    Even the dentist is quite expensive, I have heard from some people who live in New Zealand, the last thing they would do is getting their teeth cleaned in New Zealand, they would rather get their teeth cleaned or worked in Thailand or Hong Kong. I don’t blame for them, some dentists do charge $140-$200 for just cleaning the teeth.

    Compared with Hong Kong and Japan

    If I get a Asthma attack in either Hong Kong or Japan, I will be seen within 20-30 minutes

    If I have a health problem I.E. Arthritis when diagnosed in Hong Kong or Japan, my waiting time for surgery would not be very long.

    If I need to get my teeth cleaned and etc in Hong Kong or Japan, I could be paying 30-45% less when it come to costs related to dentists


    My experience with the train in Wellington is they can be very expensive, in most cases if I need to go from Epuni to Wellington:

    The train costs $6.50 during peak hours and that is the cost on Saturday and Sundays too

    The bus costs $4.00 from Epuni to Courtenay Place + transfer at Petone by using the Snapper Card

    If I buy a monthly pass for the train it will cost more than $120+ and on weekends if I need to use the monthly pass to travel, I can only travel between Epuni to Wellington and if I need to go back to Lower Hutt, the maximum I can travel is between Wellington and Pomare

    Compared with Hong Kong in Japan

    In Hong Kong if I need to catch the bus say from Hung Shui Kiu to Mong Kok, it is only $4 NZD regardless where I get off the bus in Mei Foo or Cheung Sha Wan and that includes using the Octopus Card

    In Hong Kong if I catch the tram say from Kennedy Town to Sha Kei Wan or Happy Valley or North Point each trip costs $2 HKD which is 30 cents NZD per trip

    In Hong Kong if I need to travel on the MTR which is the Railway in Hong Kong for example if I need to travel between Tsuen Wan and Central which is from New Territories to Hong Kong Island, all I am paying is $2 NZD for the single trip even on the Octopus Card for the whole trip.

    Compared with Japan since I lived a month in Kyoto in 2013, I purchased a monthly ticket to cover Kyoto and Osaka with help from a Japanese friend who lives in Kyoto, on the weekend if I do not want to travel to Osaka, I can use my monthly ticket to travel to outlying towns between Osaka and Kyoto on the condition the trains are operated by JR West. Can’t remember the cost


    In New Zealand if I want to buy Ingham chicken tenders or Sealord Fish, I am paying at least $7-$11 for the product

    In Hong Kong I am only paying $3-$4 NZD for the same product at Wellcome or Park N Shop supermarket

    Even $3 NZD in Hong Kong gets you a pretty decent meal in McDonalds, Burger King, Subway, Cafe De Coral and etc

    This is what I am saying in general:

    New Zealand’s cost of living is way higher than Hong Kong or other Asian countries in general

    Liked by 1 person

  77. I am not looking to ruin new Zealand’s reputation but I just happen to bump into this article today..
    which I found quite disturbing…but of course doesn’t surprise me…Not much “clean and pure” New Zealand found until so far .


    Although we get so much good pure healthy stuff from these people.. why ruining these beautiful people and their beautiful country just for money ? Thought you knew better than that NZ cattle farmer’s !


  78. I spent 2 months in Christchurch looking for construction work with the earthquake rebuild, and having said that found myself subject to anti Americanism.Being Canadian I was advised to sew Canadian flag patches to my clothing or Go Home or back where I came from”

    Im an experienced construction labourer that has worked on huge oil sands projects and commercial sites for some of the largest corporations, I had excellent reference s and an open work permit.

    I COULD go on and on but the only people that find work in nz are the Brits or colony people, I have never before been to a city so closed off. THERE.was not one Canadian in an employment situation. I heard the same things over and over that are on this post and comments.

    The kiwis are stupid as mud too, if you raise your kid here he or she will be and dud. And prepare yourself for the fact he will be interested in pufting.

    And it was still worth finding out what I wasn’t missing


    • Construction seems to be a touchy subject. Kiwis seem to think that they are the greatest builder around. Yet, their production methods [handsaws, dis and un-organization, double, triple, quadruple handling…] would get you run off almost any job in North America. BUT, they don’t want to hear it, especially in a NA accent. They will just flat NOT LISTEN. Anyone can be ignorant, you’ve got to work at getting stuck on stupid.

      Liked by 1 person

      • I remember hearing plenty of boasts about their supposed prowess at building, yet they lack the expertise that would enable them to rebuild the Christchurch cathedral. As we know, the houses are of appallingly bad quality. I am not a builder, but I have seen “building” in action in New Zealand from afar. It is often one or two guys working on some ad hoc tasks and I remember seeing it take at least a year to build a new cheap house of 130 sqm in Wellington. The house was cheap in its quality not in its price. Why can builders elsewhere in the world construct better buildings at lower costs compared to the “Kiwi master builders”? It is not that it is impossible to do, but rather, that stupid, lazy, arrogant Kiwis cannot do it.


    • it is an shame Luke you had to go through this. If only one kiwi would listen to you guy’s ! Cause you have about the most comfortable and pretty homes in the world (Canada) ! If I’d ever build my own home it would be an Canadian or American package for sure ! My step family is living in an American build home (old) and I’d always look back at it thinking on how comfortable it was ..I know it seems desperate but after spending time for years in chch you’ll understand why. I’ve spend time in one of the most expensive homes in NZ and yet it doesn’t come even close to what is being build in North America or Europe. AND THE SAME GO’S FOR MOST OF THE FURNITURE HERE. PEOPLE YOU CAN ORDER ONLINE FROM USA OR CANADA FOR SOOOOO MUCH CHEAPER. OR JUST ORDER FROM IKEA ! IT COULD SAVE YOU AN FORTUNE REALLY.

      And without them learning from the pro’s it doesn’t seem it will get anything better soon. Sure there are some pretty homes here but why so tiny and small (costing an fortune!) ?! I could never live in anything like that. Seems just like living in an doll house..

      You know what they are just afraid of you because they know deep inside you do know better and it is too hard to admit for them. Most of them are too proud unfortunately. Hopefully you could still enjoy your trip a bit elsewhere ?


      • And without them learning from the pro’s it doesn’t seem it will get anything better soon.

        It has been made abundantly clear that there is no need for any improvement in the “kiwi method” of building, thank you very much.
        Even though more building [of all types] goes on in 1 county of 1 state in the US, kiwis are perfectly fine in fumbling through instead of learning.

        it doesn’t seem it will get anything better soon.



        • just as you say Carpentaro… it is because people here don’t see any opportunity for a change. But they wouldn’t be human if they didn’t want an better life for themselves or and their children.. Now what parent wants to pay an fortune every month just to keep their kids a bit warm. And still everybody keeps on doing it. It is called ” thinking outside of the box” or out of new zealand would be better ! most people might not know how much people pay in an western country to keep their kids warm… and for sure the energy companies want to keep it that way. There is not such a thing as an log burner in the whole of Europe. With double glazing and insulation which doesn’t cost an fortune people don’t have to turn up the central heater not very high. After years residing here I have endlessly frustrated myself with the fact that I spend hours of trying to light the fire…. We started to use spirits but then there was a bit left which I thought was lemonade and well …why so much trouble to keep a bit warm ? Why no central heating in NZ except for the hotels?! I am leaving this year but I hate people being ripped off like here in nZ almost all the time.

          Even with the maximal use of the log burner the warmth will just disappear through the housebecause most houses are nothing more than shags…you might as well convert an cowshed..and save yourself hundreds of thousands of dollars. This is just one big housing bubble. For an outsider this seems complete stupid.


  79. Alot of what you say is true. Their education is nothing compared to other countries. Leaky home is yet another and crime/punishment and the list goes on and on.

    I live in Singapore and Auckland for some time and I would say Kiwi spend too much time and energy on tiny issues.

    The good in Kiwi is their schools (special needs) when compared to Singapore and the pace there is just right for a 50 year old guy.


  80. Hi, I found this article very interesting! My partner and I are both Kiwis and we have a 6 month old baby. We are both from working class families but have good qualifications. Trying to make your way in the country is f**king hard! Why? Because house prices are through the roof due to overseas investors/people who are looking for a nice place to raise children who are promised a land of milk and honey here. And it is SO expensive, everything is expensive here. Not to mention that the meth problem is absolutely killing the youth here, we will not be staying.
    1. You lose
    2. We lose
    3. NZ sucks


  81. My experience is significantly different.

    I am Canadian but have lived overseas for 20 years. We moved to the Nelson area 18 months ago and we are extremely happy.

    That said, I own business in Asia so I do not have the issues with employment that you have. I can imagine that would be extremely stressful and would taint the overall experience.

    We live in a rural area and were immediately embraced by our small valley community – in fact we rotate Friday drinks once a month with 4 other couples. Two couples are local – two are expats.

    Everyone looks out for everyone – if a couple is flying out our kiwi neighbour quickly informed us that it is a no-no to pay for parking at the airport — we will drive you and pick you up — and we do the same for them.

    In terms of food no doubt the grocery stores are not mega marts like you see in the US or Canada – but if you eschew the Doritos and other processed foods that take up half the floor space in the mega grocery stores (which we have always done) we have found food in NZ to be incredibly affordable.

    We get the freshest fish imaginable for a fraction of the price of most major cities —- a large sack of scallops runs about USD30 — and a kg of green mussels is a few dollars — you could feed the darn things to your dog they are so cheap!!!

    Then there the road side honesty boxes that are stocked with fruit and vegetables — you just drive up and put a few dollars in the box and you take your sack of food …. imagine trying that anywhere else — most places someone would steal the food — the money — and the table!!!

    If you eat in season — and you stay away from the imported processed foods — you can live like a king on a reasonable budget.

    Clothes – can’t comment much on that other than I work from home so I really only wear jeans and t’s or sweatshirts… I also work a lot in the garden … I buy cheap gear from The Warehouse…. never been to Walmart but I assume the quality is similar? I usually by more proper clothing when I am in Hong Kong as I need to go there for work regularly. But I can imagine being a small market prices and selection are not great

    Housing — we bought an old farmhouse on 5 hectares — fortunately the winter is not very cold here because there is not a stitch of insulation in the walls!!! We are recladding and insulating the house shortly.

    Which brings me to a topic you did not mention — that of the cost of trades people here. Gotta be the one of the most expensive places anywhere for plumbers electricians etc…. I suppose that has something to do with the fact that the Christchurch quakes have sucked in a lot of good people and there are not enough to service the rest of the country. You can wait weeks for a tiler to do a job in our area.

    We were able to get our permanent residency after 6 months of landing in NZ — we could not be happier with the decision to come here —- winters where we are mild and very sunny — and best of all – SHORT — if you are an outdoors person this is paradise — we have enjoyed the mountain biking trails — have done a lot of trout fishing — and will do two trips to queenstown again this winter to ski.

    NZ is absolutely paradise.

    Hopefully you are able to get the job situation sorted as I am sure that will raise your spirits.


    • Believe it or not, most migrants feel like this for the first year or so. You’re still in the honeymoon period – evidenced by statements like “fortunately the winter is not very cold here” comparing The Warehouse to Walmart and your amazement about honesty boxes.

      Thanks for your comments, remember we’ll be here for you when the honeymoon is over.


  82. Your experience is more likened to extended vacation.
    Employment not attached to NZ=huge difference.
    Honesty boxes used to be robbed/stolen from on a regular basis in a town I lived in,
    newspaper would report it frequently.
    NZ’s geographical location in comparison to Canada’s’ and the severity of winter is not very convincing.
    Glad you are enjoying NZ, I hope it continues.


  83. “An abundance of natural fresh water and rainforest” it’s obvious you’ve been away for 10 years. The best water quality that can be hoped for now is that waterways are fit to wade in, but not for drinking or gathering food from. As for rainforest, they’re good enough provided you’re happy to pick your way through 1080 pellets and the carcasses of dead deer, pigs,possums, native birds and other wildlife.

    Strange how the Kiwis that love New Zealand the most are the ones who don’t live there.

    Thanks for your comments, have a good time when you get back.


    • “It’s common to poison pests here in Australia too”

      Research shows that 1080 is only used in bait collars to prevent dingos killing sheep. That is very different to the NZ practice of chucking tonnes of the stuff out of helicopters over hundreds of hectares of land every year. 1080 was designed to be used in bait stations in enclosed spaces such as warehouses, not exposed to environmental conditions where it kills anything that eats it including pets and livestock, and runs off into watercourses.


  84. Rikki, I am Australian and my family has been living here for 18 months. Tomorrow, I will be boarding a plane to go back home to Brisbane. I am a teacher and after 18 months and 40+ job applications remain unemployed. So I got a job back home – 4 applications, 2 interviews, 1 job – all in the space of a week! Now we will sell our overvalued house to an Aucklander, walk away with a killing and go back home to family, better wages and warmer weather. We sincerely hoped to stay – made a go of it, bought a house, enrolled kids in school, made friends, but the high cost of living, coupled with lower wages meant we simply couldn’t pay off debts, get ahead and enjoy life. We were lucky and earned more than average but at the end of the day, long-term unemployment really got to me. Plus I missed family and old friends and the trappings of a big city. And also I didn’t like the fact that my kids are being reminded of gangs and the meth problem here. They simply didn’t even realise that such people existed before we came here. In town, everywhere you see hood rats with gang colours and are always hearing of meth contamination in houses. Depressing and sad. Can’t wait to get back home to the sunshine and beach and the ocean warm enough to swim in! See ya NZ – thanks for nothing!

    Liked by 2 people

    • Good luck Gabrielle, this is a very wise decision and you’ll not regret it. We’d be honoured if you’d write a migrant’s tale for us.

      All the best.


    • Not Auckland, Hawke’s Bay. MUCH better weather, but small town, small schools, little opportunity outside agriculture – lacks the infrastructure that generates better-paying jobs I guess…Wouldn’t live in Auckland if you paid me!


  85. Rikki

    “Australia lacks culture” Nonsense, the term is meaningless, all societies have a culture.
    Australia has been a multicultural society for three generations, unlike NZ, there’s a hundred cultures in Australia. There are two cities in Australia that have larger populations than NZ, are you really claiming that they ‘lack culture’?

    Rural societies all over the world are often not welcoming to strangers and also not representative of a country in general. As to Australia being ‘barren’, some areas are, however the country has a far richer and more diverse landscape than NZ, including real tropical areas and a great variety of wildlife. Of course NZ has some beautiful scenery, but it’s empty.
    You’re really trying too hard to to Oz bash.

    Liked by 1 person

    • [Deleted, please don’t troll. Don’t like what you read here? don’t read it. Have fun being a Kiwi living in Australia. Admin]


    • Aus living is higher quality than NZ and most Kiwis that go there unless they are very dominating people stay in Aus. NZ lifestyle is poor and crappy.


  86. Do not move to NZ unless you got money- this is not a place you can get ahead as an outsider unless you have skills that are in demand- it is a lonely isolated place and 1080 is used like mad as well as atrazine. Kiwis are not the brightest people and they are highly xenophobic, hierarchical and into the class system. Aus is much more friendly to Americans than NZ. Lots of jealousy and prejudice here though in every aspect of society they mimic or try to mimic America. They are very self-centred people and only care for their own advancement. I do not agree with the author’s experience of medicine as I have found the docs totally arrogant and closed-minded. I prefer European or N American docs and dentists. They charge a lot here and private insurance is a joke compared to Australia or US. Kiwis are not flexible people and they do not look at education but only about who you know, who you worked for before. Auckland is just as xenophobic as other places too- don’t be fooled- also more bullying and abuse in the cities for sure in work situations- it is normal for them and they allow it to happen. Kiwi women are some of the most aggressive women to work for.


  87. I was born in and have nearly always lived in Christchurch NZ and personally have always thought people who migrate very brave. I lived and worked in London for a while and learned I do not like big cities, it is not in my blood.

    Something people need to understand about New Zealand, from afar, is we’re a small country at the end of the worlds communication lines, we are not and never will be rich. We do not and never will have the amenities wealth brings.

    The amount of poorly designed and insulated housing is a reflection of this – the cost of building well has long been beyond most. And consequently plenty of people can fall into the trap that poverty is expensive (if you can only afford poor quality you’re forever replacing it as it breaks and wears out and never own lasting quality).

    New Zealand has a low wage economy, it will likely always be that way because we do not have large populations and large industries the world clamours for. Our successes are farming or niches and a consequence of that is we do not have an abundance of middle-class jobs available.

    But a benefit of it is capital does not enclose the commons, the environment is not taken from the population and beauty and joy is everywhere to experience for the energetic.

    I know from my curiosity that moving somewhere is hard on people for at least two years as what was familiar is lost and what is gained is often unfamiliar and stressful. Things done well where one lived don’t seem done well in the new home (turning right in the U.S on a red light), what is done well in the new home doesn’t always make sense, and differing cultural values cause tremendous disconnects.

    And I think a person is very brave to risk a new country and culture, the way I think I believe they need to be very self contained within themselves or family to risk uprooting relationships and move somewhere they haven’t a life’s training to navigate.

    I’m well heeled, and while my upbringing wasn’t with wealth I’ve never been deprived (nor spoiled but nobody needed to buy much to make childhood enjoyable in New Zealand) so I wonder about stories of people having it tough and I think, and wrote this to push the point home – NZ is not rich, incomes are lower, costs are higher than most other places.

    There is a good chance that anyone from a country with a large population coming here is going to have ON TOP of usual cultural shocks a financial surprise, probable disappointment, if they aren’t independently set or have particularly valuable skills and that is not going to change.

    As to cultural shock, well, I lived in Wimbledon and worked in Brixton and Hampstead Heath in London, three distinctive suburbs. If I found myself living in Brixton (then a couple of years after the riots) I’d have a different opinion of the UK than when I lived in Hampstead heath for a bit.


  88. [Deleted, please don’t troll. Don’t like what you read here? don’t read it. Have fun being a Kiwi living in Australia. Admin.]


  89. My main impression of New Zealanders? Based on visiting the country and meeting ‘expats’ in the UK is their obsession with the English. It seems to dominate every thought, action and deed. They never tire of telling you how vastly superior NZ is. It is hard work getting beyond this stage and if you think it’s worth it then go for it. I’m not out to cause offence just making an observation based on personal experience. If you’re English have even a brief conversation with a New Zealander you’ll be repeatedly reminded of it and if you dare to mention anything you’ve achieved it will be surpassed. I genuinely feel this passive aggressive (and sometimes openly hostile) ‘Tall poppy’ attitude holds New Zealanders back. If people didn’t concentrate on bigging their country (which ironically they often emigrated from) up they would get on much better.


    • I agree with your comments. I have lived in NZ a few years and there are pros and cons. I get a bit fed up with the constant vibe of “We are a special country and a special people” that comes from the NZ media.


  90. wow I am really amazed of the fact that so many people kiwi’s and immigrants alike feel exactly the same about new zealand


  91. Would love to see the NZ Herald adopt comments sections for all there articles…A chance for every one to air there views and allow the country to re-balance itself(I know i am just a dreamer but then i left NZ for AU 8 years ago and now read the paper that reinforces what a great move that was)


    • @Neil Apparently, NZ Herald occasionally turns on comment section for Page 3 stuff (well that sums up all the 3rd class articles on that silly “over-sized marketing pamphlet”


      • HA HA funny thing happened here in Perth yesterday on the radio they were advertising for kiwis who might be missing NZ and enticing them with jobs in the prison service. I compared what they were offering to what the guys can get here $51k in NZ and $80k here ?? Can only imagine the intelligence of the ones that might decide to go or return there?? Just shows THAT THEY CANT GET THE KIWIS TO DO IT….
        When i moved to NZ in 1989 i really wanted to like it 🙂 it should have been cheap and offer a lot of opportunity but nothing of the sort…Would be better if they could just install a medium level of human evolution and morals but the gang and alcohol/drug culture is to deep…one common way to stay above it is play rugby every weekend and be the ones doing the bashing.
        As to the herald its just a ######### cant be bothered…And i was there at Xmas for 2 weeks and couldn’t believe the way the news is portrayed …very plastic


        • Apparently there was a big quake towards east of NZ but according to all the shitty news on NZHerald it’s just normal. I know many of the locals will be shit scared about the overpriced markets crumbling down to pieces but hey if they need rich immigrants then it’s better to shrug it off as if it’s no big deal. I’m concerned there might be many more water pipes delivering e-coli to home (as if shit inside their brains is not enough to ruin the country!)


  92. I’ve never read so much rubbish about a place in my life! Look at the messed up state the USA is in! This couple must be very narrow minded and unwilling to fit into a new culture. Typical!

    Liked by 1 person

  93. i am semi-retired and would like to retire to new zealand. What would i need to retire to Stewart Island and is it doable permently? Thanks for your reply? Only way I could see is to live in a backpackers hostel for 30 days and stay somewhere else for a while then back to the backpackers until I felt comfortable buying a property. Comments please. Thanks, Maggie


  94. This is what my English colleague wrote to me before..”I feel privileged living in NZ, love my Kiwi mates like you Heather. I do have a lot of UK mates here and they to love this place just like me. Wouldn’t want to call anywhere else home.😉”


      • Article in herald
        Jack Tame: Hey cobbers – you’re an embarrassment today

        They are actually allowing comments on this article but guess what I live in Perth and am registered to comment on the herald but they are blocking me from doing so…I have made one comment before re housing situation there and it must have not been to there delusional way of thinking or they are not allowing anyone from Aus to comment?


        • Very interesting Neil. My comments in the past have usually been published, however recently comments about the anti-Australian bias in the NZ Herald haven’t been published. I read that Tame article and posted that the real embarrassment was Kiwis’ pathetic need to write negative articles about Australia. The paper doesn’t even bother to indicate that a comment has been deleted, it just doesn’t appear. You might be correct—comments from Oz aren’t allowed.

          I’ve never seen an MSM site that censors opinions like the Herald.


        • Hi neil,
          Considering that Jack Tame has just returned to NZ after five years in New York, I’d have thought him to be beyond this level. No sooner back than he is joining other media hacks and giving the anti-Aussie tin can a good kick. Missing from his piece was any mention that on a per capita basis, Australia takes four times more refugees than NZ.; balance is never going to be his forte.


    • +europanzz Really! You had to make an anonymous id to share that message? Ha ha ha…the wink in the messages says a lot than your advertisement for 100% BS 😉


  95. Obviously they all rode the property boom in the uk and are doing the same in nz. They are also good at turning a blind eye to the have and have nots and finally they don’t go out in the sun and burn. Wait till reality hits the nz economy and the average house price drops back to where it should be $200,000 .


    • The problem of house prices dropping to $200,000 … ignores the other reality that by that time so many other industries and workplaces will have “rightsized” to “meet their commitments to shareholders”.
      Can New Zealand cope with so many people “ready for new opportunities” that are acculturated to the idea of “foreigners are buying everything worthwhile” and “jobs for Kiwis (ONLY, but especially those who look and sound “right for the job”)?


    • He lived in the council flat in Southport with his widowed mother and was working as a cook when he met a NZ girl.. he came back to NZ with her and they got married and lived happily ever after.


  96. As I have stated before they could allow comments on 90% of material but no? . I was there last Xmas to visit family and found the media /news coverage very plastic.
    Off point comment : we used air b&b for accomodation twice one on the north shore and one in mission bay. Big mistake north shore place was an attractive looking house but must have had mold in the walls as I got asthma and mission bay had condensation running Down the walls from humidity.Bought back memories of 8 years earlier when we lived there


  97. [Deleted. Don’t troll, learn some social skills and don’t be so nasty. You call yourself a “Fairy Entertainer”? Did your parents teach you any manners? Banned. Admin]


  98. We were thinking of migrating to NZ from dubai, UAE.
    Said would check a few blogs before start the process.
    Thanks for the very detailed truth about New Zealand.
    Everyone shows a very happy rosy picture before moving to NZ. Also once there.

    The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence.


    • Rose, also take a look at the countries that are most popular with Kiwi migrants – there’s over a million of them living living overseas – as these are the countries most likely to be better than New Zealand. Just be cautious about sites like Kiwiconnect and the Kea Network who appear to be keen to attract Kiwis back to New Zealand. The *great kiwi brain drain* has been the subject of much angst over the years and the country is as keen to attract its own as it is migrants.

      One last thing, Kiwis living abroad are usually prouder and more positive about their country than those who live there, and their perceptions of it are jaded when they return. We see this in comments left here by readers, and in articles such as this on the news site Stuff.co.nz: Kiwis living overseas prouder of New Zealand than those at home. Futhermore,

      Most of the expats surveyed lived in Australia (43 per cent), while 25 per cent resided in mainland Europe. Fifteen per cent lived in the United States, and 10 per cent lived in the United Kingdom. Those surveyed largely identified as New Zealand European (89 per cent), while 13 per cent identified as New Zealand Maori.

      The company also surveyed 288 “repat” Kiwis – those who’d lived abroad and returned home – who were skeptical of New Zealand’s “clean, green” reputation. Almost half (48 per cent) felt the reputation was undeserved.

      Kea Global chief executive Craig Donaldson said 20 per cent of Kiwis lived abroad.

      Good luck with your research.


  99. If you live in one of the larger places in NZ (Auckland, Wellington, Christchurch) you’re not getting an NZ experience, you are getting a massive mix of cultures, and all the people angry about having to put up with each others cultures…is what I would have said four years ago when this was written, now most of New Zealand is like this, only with faster internet, and less jobs, and even more drunk teenagers, and most of those teenagers are from some other country.

    at least my street in Rotorua is like this, there is two people on this street who were born in New Zealand, excluding the recently born babies(and is similar in the surrounding blocks, they are all from different places, and they have been fighting and arguing with each other for about 2 years now. even the minimum wage jobs require years of experience and have minimum 30+ applicants(Source: the last time 3 times my work place put out job adverts).

    I get the feeling NZ is advertised everywhere as some clean green paradise place to live, and everyone wants to come here, its not, its hell with the walls painted pretty, stop moving here, there is to many people here already, I’ve spent my whole adult life competing with hoards of people like the woman in this article above for minimum wage jobs that barely pay the rent let alone bills, I feel sorry for her, and I’m in the same situation as her, only I was born here, don’t be like her..or me.


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