238 thoughts on “E2NZ Redux. Trapped In NZ – Father Won’t Let Child Leave”

1. Well golly. Wouldnt want the non primary carer who may not be paying for a roof over the trapped moms head or for thier child to be inconvenienced. Heaven forbid the chief sacrificer for sake of child have support or safety or her country. The midwest usa is my homeland and it beats nz on all levels. I am trapped due to a lazy deadbeat. He sacrifices n o t h i n g. To even tell grown women who do all work for kids they need permission to be home is sick and wrong. Trailing non primary non fully supportive ‘parents’ get ye to where kids have max chance at best life viz a vi the primary parents home.

2. Hi Kiwidad, thanks for your post on here! It’s brave with all these women! While I totally get your situation, ( and yes small town mid west America might be torture for me too) but one of the main issues here is the abuse suffered by many women in terms of the men we leave. Numerous stories on here tell about no financial support for the women from many men who hold this as a power card. This renders them not only helpless but angry too. I for one left South Africa after having no more money amd no more food in the fridge and no money from his very wealthy dad. This was not my choice, forced into this situation in order not to loose my child. Now I have lost him (for now).

   I think young adults should be enlightened about the realities of marrying a person from overseas. If I knew what I knew now…….

   • My children’s father became involved with drugs as well. Did the courts care? No. They interpreted Hague as a kind of formula. X number of months here, Y number of months out of here. If X > Y, child stays. That was it. They didn’t want to hear about the merits. It made their job much easier, as well, which being slack Kiwis, they definitely want an easy job. I know many expat mothers who were pressured into moving to a father’s preferred home country because the mothers was bombarded and often manipulated with arguments such as it was “a better place” or “we’ll have more family support” or “it’s more fit for a family to be raised” and other concocted reasons. When you have been lured to a place a father prefers because he knows that if he can be a boulder tied to the mother’s leg long enough then he will get legal jurisdiction, then this is just fraud. It is a sneaky scheme to pin a human being down to a geographic scrap of land where the more scheming parent has the advantage. It has nothing to do with children per se. It’s a move in a big game. In a relationship where one parent has decided it will be a chess game and the other one is not aware of it yet until the disadvantage has made itself manifest, the children are victims of a fraud, nothing more. There is no place in New Zealand that compares in terms of quality of life to almost anywhere in the developed world except for war zones in urban areas like Detroit or some chav area in the UK. Not only do the Kiwi courts wear blinkers of deluded Kiwi exceptionalism, but Hague makes their job easy if they can count months in a year. Like I said, Kiwis love it when it’s easy.

3. I’m sorry for all of your plights however take one second to think about the NZ husband/wife/partner’s side of the story. In exactly the same way you do not want to live in NZ they might not want to follow you to your home country. I am in the opposite situation. My wife is from the US and I am from NZ. If we broke up and I agreed to let her leave then I will have to go to a small town in the Midwest US , in exactly the same situation as you but in reverse. International marriages / kids are very hard and someone almost inevitably loses. Im sorry its you but if it wasn’t, it would be the other.

4. Hi

   I am not in New Zealand but moved from South Africa 9 months ago leaving my 8 year old son with his father for all the reasons above……devastated……BUT look at article 13 in The Hague Convention and research it. I have scanned the internet….now the courts in the uk (if that’s where u want to return to) listen to children as young as 7 years old.there was recently a case where a 9 year old boy visited him mom in the uk and played up so much on the flight back to New Zealand, was so traumatised by it that the pilot turned the plan around and dropped him off in Heathrow! Many judges are siding with the psychological impact this has on the mothers and as a consequence the child in the UK. I’m sorry about those of you who want to relocate to different countries…..but I will say the courts are backwards in the likes of SA and New Zealand!! Never give up though never ever. My son doesn’t want to be with dad, a multi millionaire who never gave me a penny! He is 63 for goodness sakes. Also if you can possibly imagine it the best best best chance you have IS if you can leave your child with the parent and hope they don’t want to get on the plane, from reading this I know for many this is not an option. I will not tell my son this but will wait for him to be brave enough to stand his ground….he is getting there, fed up with dad totally. I was never married to him either. Don’t be sucked in by an ex’s power, that’s what happened to me. I have awful days, but you HAVE to do your research. The Hague convention has a place….it does for kidnapping and countries like Japan etc who although have just signed, don’t follow the rules. But new research is showing all round the gap in the system for women like us. There is a change, is hope and good will always prevail…….

   • Until women have rights to speak for best interest of their flesh and blood whom they nurture pay for and protect from conception onward…it is sickening. Putting children in middle instead of acknowledging mothers rights actually helps perpetuate distress and often times abuse from the ‘father’. We have a right to pursue a full better life on behalf of our children with support. Period. You better believe the fetid fathers for equality groups state their rights first…and yet the laws favour them as the women are too busy raising kids with little support and kept poor to not have $ to influence laws…we havent come a long way baby. Why are they so afraid of women having equality?

5. http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/business/the-rebuild/9856205/Quake-repairs-Can-we-trust-insurers

   You might want to do something on this.

6. The point of all of this that you fail to understand is that the children are New Zealanders and the courts are there for the children, not the mother and not the father. All of these hard luck stories are about the parents experience. The law does not and should not care about you being tired or how you feel. The courts are there to make sure the rights of the child that are set in legislation are being met. Its is so important to remove emotion and culture to achieve target outcomes.

   • Except these children aren’t all New Zealanders, a lot of them we born abroad and some have a parent from a previous relationship. They’re trapped because New Zealand is considered to be their place of residence and one parent won’t let them leave it. You need to research this problem more thoroughly before your ill informed comments earn you a ban for trolling.

     • We should hope that the highly technical interpretations of Hague soon stop, because children are suffering. Kiwi spouses do prevent foreign parent and children from leaving a bad place and many of these fathers did stalling manoeuvres until they stole this habitual residence status.The mothers would have left that country much sooner had the Kiwi parent not deliberately placed obstacles to their leaving, even very soon after arriving. Being in a place for x months does not mean that it is good for the children to stay in that place. New Zealand is an English speaking lower developed country in the Pacific with many problems. Many of these mothers wanted to return to their families for support and a better standard of living elsewhere. This is what is good for children. There is nothing about New Zealand as a society or geographic place, or New Zealand ‘living’, that is good enough excuse for forcing a non kiwi parent to stay there with only half kiwi offspring. Nothing at all. Quite the opposite in fact.

   • how can you say that the best interests of the child are being meet if the main parent is depressed and suffering, how is that beneficial to the child’s wellbeing. Also what if the child has no family in New Zealand other than their parents but all their other family members such as grandparents, aunties, uncles and cousins are all overseas, doesn’t it benefit the child to know their family and culture. For a child to be happy and well adjusted they need to have a parent who is also happy and well adjusted, as scientific research can prove.

   • Women who raise pay for and support their children on all levels have the right to make decisions on behalf of their children. Your ignorance of how marriages break down, how much the woman already gives up to follow a spouse to a foreign country and how abusive men are backed in court is astounding. The hague convention was not originally written to punish mothers and the laws since (MAN made) are grossly misinterpreted and carried out based on a patriarchal forget the childrens rights mysoginistic way. Trust me if majority of trapped disenfranchised empoverished sole providers were men…the laws would be struck down. They violate basic human rights and strip children at a chance at full life. I only know of abusive men who didnt pay any child support or support kidz even in marriage to drag foreign moms through relocation nightmare. Its a power play and their last consideration is the child. Let the less involved parent go where child and chief supporter goes. My ex loves that we are isolated and in poverty. Those elements are cornerstone of abuse.

7. http://www.justanswer.com/newzealand-law/4hvbr-daughter-us-citizen-new-zealand-teach.html

   “My daughter is a US citizen who came to New Zealand to teach

   My daughter is a US citizen who came to New Zealand to teach at a Montessori school for three years. She met a Kiwi who did not tell her he was an alcoholic and gambler until she was about 5 months pregnant and he stole her bank card and stole $1000. Now they are living separately but he has put an injunction against her to prevent her from leaving New Zealand. The father was born in the US also but his mother was a New Zealand citizen and his father is Samoan. The baby is also a US citizen. Does my daughter have any rights? Or are her son and she hostages in New Zealand.
   They never married.”

   I wonder what became of that case.

8. It is amazing that the American lady from Whangarei got away with her “runner” (how did she do it?), because I and other women who disliked the so-called “lifestyle” in New Zealand were instructed by our respective counsels not to do a runner, because we would be pulled right back by Hague. We were told to play it completely straight “or else”. And we all knew a couple of them who had been pulled back, and a few who had been “scared out of even trying”. In actuality, we would probably have had a better chance with a runner than with the horrid, clogged, ignorant, biased courts. Despite the children having been born in a different country, often, most mothers are forced to stay anyway. The years they spend fighting to persuade the spouse to move home, futilely, and the years spent tussling in court, all merely add to the weight of the legalistic habitual residence argument, because the family spends all that geographic time in New Zealand. Which is counted against the spouse wanting to move. I know a bloke who works in a mental hospital, and he told me there are many, many migrants in there, a number way out of proportion, driven around the bend by the “lifestyle”, or more accurately, the dissonance between the purported “lifestyle” and the “survival experience” many migrants end up enduring. How many of these foreign spouses were being forced to live in New Zealand because the Kiwi spouse would not “consent” to moving back, once the family had been dragged there and anchored but hating it? Somehow that is never brought up. The Kiwi parent’s right to trap their spouse and kids in their phoney paradise, however, seems to be sacrosanct. Just do not move to New Zealand with children, or have children there, until you have lived there at least a couple years and are sure you want to stay!

9. http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B00FV80PTM

10. There is no option to leave message on the FB page, will I leave my email address on here, or is there a link you can send?

    • Please check your private messages on your twitter account.

11. If she would speak to american mum trapped in oz w kids. Ex at this moment threatening court and taking kids frim me. Guess his illegal trip to bali when he doesnt pay his child support didnt go well. Myst be nice to have a passport and no shared responsibility just all rights. and it will never b enough for him. His mission is to destroy and courts help the destroyers.

12. If she would speak to smericsn mum trapped in oz w kids i went thru things a horrid womens daytimeiniseries wont cover. As we type the x i left 9 years ago is smsing he will rip children from me. I already lost a fiance my giant family in states socioeconomic status and he exhausts me while i work saying i have to leave to hand deliver to he who vacations overseas w no job or inclination to pay back child support. Oh and apparently i am abuser. Aussies can travel to disneyland but my american kidz n i cannot….

13. I would like to send my details for the research the professional advisor wants. How do I send a private message?

14. A well regarded professional advisor is able to offer emotional support to mothers trapped in New Zealand, especially those who have lost 50% or more of their time with their children.

    She is based in Auckland and is conducting a research project. She would like people to get in touch with her. We can’t publish her email and phone number here but will pass them on to anyone who’d like them. Please leave a message, or send us a private message on Twitter or Facebook.

    Thank you, and good luck.

15. http://judgethejudges.co.nz/ViewTheHandsJudgesHaveDealtVictims

16. http://www.smh.com.au/national/family-court-refuses-to-send-quakeaffected-boys-back-to-new-zealand-20140126-31gvf.html Go Australia!

    The Family Court of Australia has rejected an attempt by New Zealand authorities to secure the return of two boys who were unlawfully taken to Sydney by their mother after the 2011 Christchurch earthquakes, finding that the children would be further traumatised if they were ordered home.
    The mother of the boys, aged 10 and 12, took them from the devastated city without telling their estranged father and built a new life in Sydney, according to a Family Court judgment published recently.
    The woman said she fled the city because her house had been rendered uninhabitable by the powerful quakes, that it was then looted by hooligans and that she had lost her job when her employer went out of business.
    These experiences had significantly traumatised her two children, with the younger of the two suffering post traumatic stress disorder characterised by insomnia.
    Advertisement
    The court heard that, despite the fact the boys had effectively been abducted, with their mother failing to report the move to their father or New Zealand authorities, the youngsters subsequently settled into their new home.
    Both were experiencing a ”higher standard of living than before”, had settled into new schools, found new friends, and built relationships with counsellors.

    Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/national/family-court-refuses-to-send-quakeaffected-boys-back-to-new-zealand-20140126-31gvf.html#ixzz2rXKetXcq

17. The sad thing about it is, “it’s nothing to do with welfare – it’s all about jurisdiction”. http://www.essentialmums.co.nz/family-life/family-dynamics/9002803/Kiwi-tug-of-love-children-on-the-rise

    • Ironic that a law designed to protect children reduces them to nothing more than objects.

18. Sign me up. The laws should not exist. The primary carer should decide the place children live. My x does not much and isnt even made to pay child support. And i am trapped in oz under poverty line. Shared responsibility is a crock as it means primary carer is trapped and has to cowtow to the ex whilst having full responsibility and ex gets all rights. Sorry but non primary parent must be forced to pay true child support based on true cost of raising kids regardless of whether or not they feel like holding a job and get off their bums to see children where primary carer chooses to move. Sadly its typically the abusive male who even thinks to trap a woman and kids with no support or extended family as way to continue to abuse. And the courts fully back their play. Noone gave me a discount on my visa or warning on passport i would be trappep here. No offer of discounted anything to b forced to live here. Yet i also get put down for being an immigrant in an intolerant society. Visa status now officially HOSTAGE!

19. My story is: I am a dual citizen of New Zealand and Canada. Born in NZ and lived my life in both countries. I married a kiwi and we had four children. When our marriage broke up because of his lies and infidelities, I decided to move back to Canada. We had a mutual agreement written up by lawyers, stating specifically that the children were to spend time with both parents, and could decide who to live with, in what country on an international basis, and neither parent would challenge each other. Well, my daughter who came with me first, wanted to stay in Canada with me, then changed her mind once she had been back in his care for a few short months. My two sons were with me in Canada, and did not want to go back to NZ, but the ex husband challenged me with Hague Convention, so the Canadian judge sent my boys back with him inside of 24 hours! We didnt even know he was here. Judge said because the agreement was made in NZ it had to be fought there. So of course the ex has blown everything up, lied in affidavits, bullied and manipulated my children and others. I have had no contact with my children for 8 months, and prior to that I only saw my boys for 10 hours when I was in NZ for 5 weeks! My ex has been given so many rights, I have exhausted legal aid, as I never thought we would have to spend money on court for this. Even the lawyer I had said the NZ Family Court is a joke. My parents live less than an hour from my children, yet because my ex owes them money and his new wife (moved in 5 days after I left the family home) doesn’t like anyone, they are banned from seeing or speaking to my children. My parents spent so much love, time and money supporting us when we were married, they are in their 70’s now, and they have not had contact with my children for over 18 months. The ex has even banned some of his own family from my children because they support the children having me in their lives. It is such a mess, and has caused me great upset and stress in my life. Moving back to NZ is not the answer. Having communication with my children is. I homeschooled my children for 5 years, while he was betraying us all. Now I am made to look like the wrong doer, just because I wanted my children to experience their roots in Canada. I am a the point where I want the media to know the injustice within the NZ Family Court, Is anyone with me on this? What can we do?
    Angie

    • They have the ability to brainwash, don’t they! Very good at it. Never trust them. Never trust any agreement coming out of them, on or off paper. We had an agreement that we could return if it did not work out which my ex was on record as having made with us. Once they get the kids there, it doesn’t matter. Nothing matters except that a Kiwi gets to have his blood there in his country with him. This is the typical experience many of us have had with NZ Family Court. I for one was encouraged to present a straitjacketed desubstantiated case for moving away, completely stripped-down, containing no emotion, distress (judge concluded therefore that I was a cold person – he probably would have concluded I was mentally ill if I had included any emotion! There is no winning with them!), avoiding anything negative (and even just leaving important factors out, no matter how critical the factors were in shaping the actions we took in New Zealand whilst living there) or I would “look worse to the court”, and my ex with his lawyer’s help manipulated, fibbed, twisted,and spun, made OTT and erroneous assertions. I did not understand why he could get away with everything playing fast and loose when I couldn’t. What’s good for the gander surely! But no. I am sure they knew full well the judge’s lack of time to make a decision,and the extreme cultural provincialism. (how to “play” these in their favour). The upshot is, the judge will think that you could well enough move back to New Zealand, and the odds are against you. If you want to see your children, I would recommend that you move back there and fight for as much time as you can get with them. He’ll give you a hard time, and your sanity will be challenged, but at least you will have your parents nearby.

20. I know for our part that we wanted to leave soon enough after moving there, and my partner did all sorts of things to make it hard for me to function there. His delay tactics made it possible for him to grab habitual residence. Evidence of this was ignored by the judge. My child was not even a NZ citizen and has siblings who were not even half-Kiwi. If they can trick you one way or another into staying there with the kids for a certain amount of time, you are screwed. Even if you can prove that they used those tactics. The judges don’t care. All Kiwis have this idea that New Zealand is a safe haven for families. On this site, we know the truth about its underbelly and endeavor to inform..

21. I am stuck in NZ so I can be near my 2 kids, my family is far away. I have never lived in NZ and only moved here for 3 years so the kids could connect with my ex’s family and then the plan was to spend 3 years in Aus to be near my family. We separated a year after we arrived and now the ex is refusing to let the kids leave NZ. I have applied for Hague through the US dept of State which forwarded my case to the NZ central authority. NZ authority says I don’t have a case. There is a large body of evidence in Hague cases where spouses wrongfully retain the children and the children are duly returned to the original country where the agreement was made but it seems NZ chooses to ignore this. Unfortunately the Hague convention does not define “habitual residence” and leaves that to the relevant courts to decide. I believe the convention is outdated and needs to be revised so that it is no longer possible to retain children permanently in the new country when the agreement was either conditional (e.g. are both spouses happy living in the new country) or temporary (e.g. we will stay for 3 years and then move).

    I want to group like minded people together to address these injustices. It is NOT ok for one parent to decide the future of the children without the agreement of the other spouse. If we don’t speak up and do something nothing will change.

    • I am same situation with people in here. I have been in court case about 3 years. I am treated badly and very unfairly by court system and I am so tired of it and feel hopeless. My ex is abuser and full of lie and not thinking about my daughter but just using court system. I would like to meet people who have same situation and discuss about it. I am not English speaker so it is so hard for me to running around for court case and very depressed that I am trap in this country.

      • Are you in Auckland? If you are and comfortable leaving a contact detail (e-mail) or something like that here, I will contact you. I am not a Kiwi either, I am of chinese descent.

        • We’re advising people to contact each other through the Facebook self help group https://www.facebook.com/ExpatStuckMums

        • Hi, Sorry that I am late reply. I would like to be able to talk to you. My email is sherrychan777@yahoo.co.jp Please email me.

        • Hi, trapped, how are you? If you see this, please email to sherry777@yahoo.co.jp Thank you.

22. Hello

    It’s not just in New Zealand, it’s happening in Germany too.

23. I am in same boat after horrific witch hunt relocation court situation in AU. Poverty ridden alone w two kids and ex had to do nothing..not even pay child support. My kids have never met their american family. It is blatant abuse of me and children sanctioned and reiterated by alleged law professionals. A travisty and violation of basic human rights. Contact me ! Hal

24. Stuck in chch for another 8yrs or give up custody WTF!!!
    I cant beleive this is the case there has to be a stink we can put upn about this
    I read in the earlier/first posts there was mention of leaving details and getting this happening – Where can I leave mine??!!

25. Wow, many of these examples above seem like a nightmare you just never wake up from.

    My wife had a child from a previous marriage and the husband was being a real jerk. The child was stuck in a European country outside of the EU. The country is so messed up that the father wasnt even living there and he would not sign the papers to release his own son to come to the country where we reside and (the father) also resides.

    Anyway, to cut a long story short, I paid off a judge to get the correct paper work signed off and the child was soon with us. I have always encouraged the father to visit, I dont care about the money but with all my efforts he visisted twice over two months and he has had no contact with the child since (7 years) although he is maybe a two hour drive away. (The Fathers) parents are always visited each time we visit the childs country of orgin at my insistence. I always attempt to keep up contact and keep it friendly because sometime in the future we maybe looking for a rare blood group if the child needs it.

26. there needs to be more leeway in the law…each case judged on it’s own…
    why should one parent be so underpinned financially,emotionally and without family when left in such a vulnerable predicament …it is tantamount to a violation of human rights….it seems strange even stupid to go on about the rights of the children yet abortion is okey dokey i am not at all demeaning women who have done so particularly because they have no support in many cases and are bereft of solution…..who in the umpty do makes these dumb badly put together laws…..unbelievable….

    • It sure seems to be a violation- does any one know the outcome of the Mum who was hunger striking last year?

27. I have been reading this blog and need to let you ex=pats, immigrants etc.. know that – it is NOT just you’ll that the NZ courts are trapping in NZ. It is ALL Mothers, kiwi also!!!
    I have been trapped here for about 12 years out of a 16 year sentence.
    They will keep all the kiwi kids here in NZ – regardless of the gender parent who wants to leave. There is NOTHing you can say to make the judge see the truth – it is all true what the original poster was saying – but please people – it is NOT your nationality etc… the courts here will not let children leave until 16 when they have no say – what options we have are virtually zero – make a run for it- I left it too late to do that! Yes, the courts here favor fathers – but not STEP-fathers – only bio dads, only thing that I know will help you is if he has been found to sexually abusive to the child – only grounds the court consider him a little unfit.
    I have 1 child left out of 4 – waited all these years – now i will leave next year and have her visit me- then i will let her stay in Canada and try to get the court to help there.. .not sure .. only idea I have left… any support welcomed also.. and i will help you if I can.

28. There is “expat stuck mums” I think, if you google it.

29. Does anyone know of online support groups, NGO’s or SOMETHING where I could get some support and comfort? Thanks!

30. Thanks Mary! I do that and my son and I have a really good relationship. He is very happy and healthy too. it’s just me that lives heart broken. It’s not just that I don’t like it in here, this place makes me depressed with an 8-month long winter. I just don’t fit into this culture and I miss my own. I also feel bad that my parents cannot be active grandparents (although my mom is great at sending him packages and talking on Skype) and that my son is growing up as a norwegian. How do you deal with all this frustration? I don’t find anyone to talk about these things with, nobody understands, everyone assumes I should be happy to come from south america and live in such rich and safe country but as I said, I never had any interest to move here at all and the frustration to be stuck here takes all the energy out of me :_(

31. Try to be positive and involved with your child’s life as much as you can. Make your home a celebration of what you are. He might have stolen the home field, but make your time with your child as intense, happy and memorable for him as possible.

32. Wow! Thank you everyone for shearing your stories! I have had the loneliest the last 3 years after I separated my Norwegian husband here in Norway (I’m from Argentina, we met in Bolivia and came to Norway when I got pregnant for my ex to “get a job and save some money and then go back to south america”). Although we always agreed to have our child (now almost 6) spending some of his childhood in Norway and some of it in Argentina, all of this changed after we broke up. Just recently we had a plan to spend 2014 there (To complete a master program I’m doing) but now he changed his mind again!!! Since we share custody, there’s nothing I can do about it!!! I’m so down and sad and devastated. I see I’m not the only one, though. but how can we help each other? How can this change? I have suffered from stress, anxiety, anger problems, depressions and a lot of loneliness since I moved here. Norway is a cold and dark place and it does not do me well. Raising a child as a single mom, in a foreign country with such a different culture is killing me!!! Also, I never agreed to raising my son as a “norwegian” and it’s heart breaking to see that he is less and less argentinean every day. There really needs to be a way to deal with these situations!!! I’m desperate! :_(

33. Please read this…. my little brother who has just turned 10 has been in the family courts system since he was born, he has his own lawyer but it seems the family court keeps granting his biological father with the benefit of the doubt.. his biological father has been diagnosed with narcasism, and is incapable of feeling empathy for anything or anyone, he shot himself in the head with a nailgun when my Mum tried to flee. My brother has to see this guy every second week because it’s “the law” . recently my brothers biological Dad told my little bro that he was going to kill our Mum and that it was his fault, and that he would cut him up also. We told the court, the court believed the biological Dads lies, and visititation has proceeded as usual… the courts are not listening to us. He’s 10 years old for gods sake! why the hell do the family courts ignore what is clearly right in front of them??? He is abusing my brother right under their noses and they have proof and everything. Sometimes I think the only solution is to grab my brother and leave the country.. at least he would be safe.

    • I just went through the courts and the magistrate appeared to be very sympathetic to my ex partner who has been making my daughters life so difficult over the past three years. I love the comment about the family court system being a plumbing system with only poo coming out of it. A very well written piece. It is very infuriating to watch my expartner represent himself and parade around the court while I use a barrister who sits pretty
      Much silent. The magistrates pathologise a mother’s love. I think fathers are jealous of mothers. The children are property in the family courts. It’s all about ownership. It’s total bollocks that the process has anything to do with the interests of the children. It is really vile that they even tell themselves that that is what they value. A deep sense of knowing the truth keeps me resilient to and peaceful in the wake of the lies spoken and the magistrates inaccurate summing up. I was described
      as subtly manipulative and possibly resistant to my daughters independence. This was in a situation when my daughter was having panic attacks, suicidal thoughts and continual resistant to going to her father… What was i supposed to do when the father told me that her behaviour was “nothing to
      worry about”? It’s laughable an impossible to come out portrayed positively from the family courts as a mother, in
      my experience, unless you hand
      over your children to the father.

34. Dear you,
    I can hear your pain and your frustration. I writing from Melbourne where I have met many many women who are in your and my situation. It’s an extraordinarily awful predicament which very few people understand unless they are going through it. In Australia the law means that if the father has even the slightest interest or contact with his children then the courts rule that it is “the child’s right to have a relationship with their father”. Basically the mother’s liberties or best interests are completely swept aside by this notion of the child’s right to have a father. I have seen incredibly unfair court outcomes. And the mother, like me, simply has to accept that the next fifteen years are to be lived in australia. It comes from an idea that a child is a piece of property owned 50/50 by the two parents. Unless the father has an incredibly disturbingly bad criminal record his right to keep the child here wins again and again. Now in new Zealand it might be different… I want you to know you are not alone and that hundreds of women domt realise the legal consequences of separating when they are not in their own country. I wish the family laws of australia and elsewhere were more well known. You can come here (I was from the uk) feeling so light and free but it’s a big bursting bubble isn’t it when the family law courts wheels start turning. I want you to know that I hear your pain. I hope your beautiful child brings you wonderful happy times and great shifts occur. I hear your story and wish you so much strength and health.

35. I’m a American in the same situation in Ireland. I fled domestic violence from my sons Irish father and made the huge mistake of going to a women’s refuge thinking I had finally found help. In three weeks time due to the HSE’s demands because of the economy(so we were told by staff) they moved us to the non- national homeless unit in Dublin where were have been treated horrendously, my son was even physically man handled by one of the ”caretakers.”

    We are now in a hotel in one of the worse location in Dublin and had to be moved to different floor because of the harassment and bullying my son has received by the travellers, drug addicts, prostitutes and ASBO Irish family’s being housed here.I magine not being able to cook for your children and being stuffed in one room for months and months. Before we were placed in hostels run by bullies, and trust me the people that run these places have no business minding hamsters much less family’s in crisis like most of us are. We are totally alone and abandon in this country.

    My gentle little boy cry’s for his pets, toys and the few friends we had to leave behind. The courts gave his father visitation once a week and I was told if I don’t produce my son I will be jailed and as a punishment he will get even more access to his son who is terrified of him.

    My heart physically aches reading the pain on this website. All your words mirror so much of my situation. Ireland has a draconian family court system. Nothing is taken into account and the judges don’t want to know. I was also overwhelmed at the time and now I regret I didn’t fight harder but I don’t think it would have mattered.

    Ireland does not like foreigner’s unless they are paying tourist is my experience. I would warn any parent of a child travelling abroad to read this website before they make the mistake of having a family with someone from another country.

36. The latest cr*p academic theory is that if family members are tethered to a child’s life in a location that he or she is familiar with, that the child will do better. Simplistic thinking, yes. And regardless of the fact that one or both parents may not get along well or one or both parents may be dysfunctional, have substance abuse problems, issues with finding decent work or housing, are culturally poorly acclimated to the place they are being held hostage, or have brought a new partner to the mix with their own problems. It is insane. I hope the thinking is changing based on the fallout from implementing this faulty psych theory in the courts. I think foreign parents fare especially poorly in Australasian courts. Their fates vary depending on circumstance. I have heard some nightmare stories from New Zealand and Australia, and seen hostage mothers in some bad situations. For years.

37. I am american trapped in australia with my american born son and aussie born daughter. I was denied basicrights in court and told repeatedly by lawyers barristers the judge and ‘childrens lawyer’ (laughable as he never bothered to know their names and never met them) that ‘i did not count’. The ex never pays child support gambled and beat me down on all levels including bashing me when i hsd my son in my arms etc etc…but i am not even allowed to visit home with kids. He wont ‘allow’ passports and i am trapped in poverty under impossible circumstances. He was never even questioned in court was able to accuse me of being insane and was treated like a hard done by parent and i was held up like some witch in a salem court. Australia needs another visa category: hostage.

    Sickened that sociopaths are actually able to use court
    To further harm their ex’s and the children. ‘In the best interest of the children’????? To add insult to severe injury i cannot make him have 50/50 true shared responsibility according to courts so that i can at least salvage a career and get respite as i have noone here to help. Nor can he be made to pay child support. Whst the????

    • I’m just crying here reading your story as it’s just like mine in Ireland.

38. Hi
    My brother finds himself in the same situation with two kids 5 and 8 where they were born in the USA and moved to their mothers hometown in New Zealand with my brother. They were then supposed to spend some years in Australia after a few in nz but since then his wife recently announced separation and has no intention of leaving New Zealand. This leaves my brother stuck there as he can’t desert his kids.
    How have things progressed for you?
    Amelia

    • Amelia,
      My brother is in a very similar situation, in NZ, as your brother – their kids are the same age, too. Would be great if they could connect. If you read this will you email me?

39. Im in a situation where my husband from the UK is trying to relocate back to the UK with our daughter and we currently live in Australia. Its horribly hard and expensive to defend this. I am confident I can win this but I just don’t know. The stress and the sleepless nights is definitely taking a toll. He has insisted on a 50/50 shares custody arrangement which is also taking its toll on our daughter. I feel for all you mums out there as it so easily could have been me stuck in the UK and fighting to get back to my home country where my family lives.

40. New Zealand is a hard place to live. Being trapped by Hague in somewhere like America or Europe with airfares to go see your family being affordable, and more jobs, cheaper cost of living, and all, versus being trapped on a remote poor island with all those factors being harder for you = two different things. These parents trapped in New Zealand are often looking forward to a decade and a half of poverty, alienation, etc.

41. I am in exactly the same situation as you but living in Australia. Being a New Zealander I do not get financial support such as a benefit from the Australian government even though I have worked and been living in Australia for over 3 years. My baby has a New Zealand passport and my baby’s father is also a New Zealander. I want to come home but I am trapped here.

42. I am going though the same situation from England so is my daughter but trapped by nz laws feel like a prisoner here

43. i think you are very brave,this whole system is rotten ,ill conceived and stupid,anything enlightened on the custody subject is in the too hard ,i’m alright jack basket,…
    we seem to nurse the wrong people,for instance someone who dishonestly enters nz and a whole load of sympathizers carry on like the person concerned was some kind of messiah,they get all the 1st class treatment,whilst decent mother’s and father’s seeking justice get a cart load of rhetoric rubbish from the law and lawyers spouting equal nonsense…my prayers go with you,people find it easier to save the kiwi or some bird or snail much more personnel equipped and funded……nutty

44. Hi Everybody,

    I will Start a HUNGER STRIKE ON THE 15 th OF JULY IN THE ORAKEI DOMAIN. ( The date me and my daughter were planning our trip)

    I DEMAND MY FREEDOM AND THE FREEDOM OF MY CHILD . I AM REFUSING TO BE A PART OF A SYSTEM MISUSED BY BULLIES AND CRIMINALS .
    I WANT JUSTICE . I WANT THE FREEDOM AS A TURKISH CITIZEN TO GO TO TURKEY. I WANT THE FREEDOM AS A MOTHER TO TEACH MY CHILD HER CULTURE AND HERITAGE .

    I WANT TO BE RELEASED FROM MY IMPRISONMENT IN NEW ZEALAND BECAUSE I GAVE BIRTH HERE.

    I WILL NOT BACK UP, WILL NOT STOP MY HUNGER STRIKE UNTIL I WILL DIE OR GET MY RIGHTS AS A MOTHER TO GIVE MY CHILD A FREEDOM TO LIVE
    WITHOUT BEING BULLIED HER WHOLE LIVE.

    TO PEOPLE WHO THINK what kind of mother goes on a hunger strike here is my answer:

    A MOTHER WHO LOVES HER CHILD WILL FIGHT FOR HER FREEDOM . I REFUSE TO BE A PRISONER IN NEW ZEALAND / I REFUSE TO LEAVE MY CHILD BEHIND/
    I REFUSE MY CHILD TO GROW UP WITHOUT MEETING HER GRANDPARENTS OR ANY RELATIVES / I REFUSE TO SEE MY CHILD SUFFER .

    IF YOU ARE IN PRISON THE THINGS YOU CAN GIVE YOUR CHILD ARE LIMITED

    My name is Tijen Kizildere my daughter is Ilana Kizildere Sakgun born 3rd of November 2004.
    Her father is T.S

    I am in New Zealand since 2004 and since I arrived, I lived under constant threat and abuse of T.S
    I had to stay in the Woman’s Refuge during my pregnancy .

    This bullying and assault goes on since years but he started to use our Daughter after she was born to abuse and insult me even further,
    constantly threatening me with separating me from my child.

    I am the only person who does look after Ilana since nearly 6 years , I have the day to day care of my child. T.S refused to make any Parenting arrangements.
    Refused to pay any Child Support. I didn’t get any support or Government hep during this 6 years.

    Me and Ilana was granted a protection order against T.S by the Police.

    He is using Ilana to keep me in New Zealand and punish me . I never could go back to visit my parents or my Country so didn’t Ilana.
    My daughter has the right to learn her Culture and language .

    Now he placed again an Order Preventing Removal of Child from New Zealand . Me and my daughter did let him know about our plans and he was happy for us to
    go until again he changed his mind again.

    I can not leave New Zealand as I have no family here in NZ to look after Ilana while I am away and I do not want to leave my daughter behind.
    My daughter Ilana doesn’t want to stay with her father and I do not won’t her to stay with him neither as I do not trust him.

    I have text messages and proof and people who would testify against what king of father he is.
    I have text messages where he states that he can not come and see Ilana or take care of here as he is under medication.

    But T.S can go and apply whenever he feels like to the family Cord for an emergency order to be made without letting me know or any investigation.

    I DO NOT HAVE ANY ENERGY OR TIME LEFT TO DEAL WITH LAWYERS AND CORD HEARINGS , AS EVERY TIME HE IS BORED HE GETS LEGAL AID AND GOES TO CORD WITHOUT ACTUALLY WANTING ANYTHING.HE STEALS MY AND ILANA S TIME AND MONEY . LAST TIME THE CORD CASES FOR PARENTING ARRANGEMENTS TOOK NEARLY 1 YEAR AND HE WAS IN BREECH OF ALL THE ORDERS MADE. AND AGAIN NOTHING HAPPENED TO HIM . HE IS STEALING OUR LIFE AND TURNING IT INTO HELL WITHOUT GETTING PUNISHED OR BEING A FATHER TO ILANA .

    Please call me if you have this kind of experiences or if you can help .

    Phone: 021 183 0530
    Email: contact@nok.co.nz

45. my daughter is in the middle of a custody battle in a foreign country and is a nz citizen,just the same old rubbish from the law fraternity coupled with their unabashed greed for services.she cannot get a job there…husband divorced without any discussion,installed a young workmate girl in his home and expect the children to carry on regardless…walked out…left my daughter with debt….she scrapes along with my husband and i helping her…her ex earns $300.000per yr..and pays her $1,200 per month which is her rent in a tin pot 2 bed…nothing for food hospital visits……and their law in fact our stupid law here in nz also…espouses nonsense as well……for the benefit of the children….my big toe…what a load of garbage……the parents need to have the whole history put forward to the court and and then talk about the benefit of the children…..there is a parallel issue here……any country should have no lawful right to hold a foreigner in a country just because the spouse happens to be in the resident country as at the divorce time….the whole picture should be looked at especially the history of some of these ding bat so called father’s and mother’s …..for goodness sake someone get moving and get this totaly nutty hague convention junk sorted…..whew…..so there we are….

46. Hi I hear and feel for him in a very similarly situation but I’m in oz with 18 month old my lawyer says it could take a couple of years t be solved I have no one hear been married for 14 years came t ozas a backpacker meet my husband then two years ago we decided t have baby then he told me at 3months it’s over imdeperatly wanting t go backi have a intervention order on him for domestic violence I can’t believe I’m in this situation I hear hundreds of stories through out the world where this is happening many with not good out comes the should teach these situation at school because I wouldn’t wish this on any one I any one can help advise please let me know

47. Trapped, they have you sewed up pretty tightly there, basically handing the father the reins of control over your own life through your concern for your son, and I am sure you feel very alone as well, with your ex’s family doing the “blood thicker than water” thing (very familiar to most of us on this thread). Especially considering how much his family might have contributed to your disliking New Zealand in the first place. They are using the thin end of the wedge on you, so you can probably look forward to years in court trying to hold on. They will try to completely wrest your kid away to “kiwi-ise” him. The judges seem to think that boys in particular need to be “bloke-ised” by Kiwi fathers. They tend to be very sexist that way. If you had a daughter, it would be easier. Push for a communication schedule when he is away from you, and hold your ground, don’t let them chip away at your care time. You know what’s good for your own kid. You don’t want him becoming like his dad, I am sure. Be staunch girl! Make sure you find a lawyer that does the business for you and do everything you can to see if you qualify for legal aid. You might even write and file your own motions. Make it “very much not worth the trouble” to try and take your kid away from you.

48. Hi all,
    Wow I thought I was the only one in this situation! I have a seven year old son and I’m Irish and his dad is a kiwi. We met while travelling and he sold me the kiwi dream, we moved here and soon afterwards my son arrived. Things didnt work out and we seperated when my son was 18 months old. Despite my ex going a little crazy I said I would stay here and even though we are no longer together he still had a lovely son in his life.
    All was going well till school and we had shared care. My ex decided he wanted full custody as he has family support here and country life is better blah blah blah. Well we went to court and it was horrific! I don’t know what planet the judge is on, I got upset and said I wanted whats best for my son and he basically laughed and told me to get control. To make it worse my ex brought his whole family to court so I had to walk past them all when going in and out of court! The judged ruled for my son to be with me during the week and his father gets to see him after school on a Wednesday and two out of three weekends. But the killer was I can only go to Ireland once every two years, can’t take my son out of school for more then two weeks, can’t go for longer then four weeks and for every hour his dad misses out on he gets to make this time up whenever he likes. I also have to give three months written notice to my ex before I can go. I didn’t manage to take it all in but what about my families rights to make up for time they don’t get to spend with my son??? They miss him dearly and I’m now too scared to go as I know my ex will tack his time onto the already abundant 4 weeks he got allocated for during school summer holidays so possible meaning he’ll have my son for six weeks and I won’t have a right to see him! Which I know would really upset my son he struggles going out for a week and when he comes back he gets up at all hours of the night for hugs and just wants to be close to me, it breaks my heart.
    The judge even said to me that due to my ex’s behaviour when we separated i could have gotten full custody back then if I wanted!
    I’m growing to really dislike this place and feel totally trapped and alone. Kinda glad to know there are others out there like me don’t feel so alone 🙂
    Hugs to all may we all get home someday 🙂

    • Hi, I was in the Family Court last month for my relocation case. I was denied relocation, denied holiday time and also the stupid Judge increased the contact time for my ex. She now awards him 5 out of 14 days. I have a few more days left before my appeal period is closed. I feel that the Judge already discriminated against me from day 1 of the 3 day hearing. She picked on my skinny weight, my Asian culture, and seems to idolise my ex. I feel so alone here. I wrote to every political party in NZ but they refuse to help. All the lawyers here wants to charge $300/hour to help. None of them understand how hard it is for me in NZ, alone without family.
      The stupid Judge even dictate what time and when I can call my child when he is not under my care! I am not allowed to say good night to my child every night! He is not even 5 years old yet.

      • It is all a big stage, and your actual access to the human judge who is making these important decisions about your child’s life is extremely limited. So you are dependent on what your lawyer chooses to say. When you see your ex stand up in a nice shirt, lying so smoothly, with his lawyer-coached delivery, and can barely believe your eyes because he’s nothing like the controlfreak lazy, druggie, nasty reeking mess of a wankeryou had to live with day in and day out for years until you escaped, and you think the judge surely must see through this…well, they don’t. Family Court is a “stage”, and a game of Chinese Whispers. Your day-to-day reality that led you to have to leave this awful person for your child’s sake is “lost in translation” through all the hoops you have to jump through. Family Court is like a plumbing system, and I don’t see anything but poo coming out.

        • Thank you U.B. I feel the same about the Family Court. But it seems to be the only way I can even try to plead for a holiday out of NZ. Everyone I turn to tells me to go back to the Court. Neither my son or I have seen my family members for 3 years now and I dont know when we can. It’s that non-removal order that is ridiculous. Is there any idea out there? And I agree with the well presented ex… (not to mention much well off too)

      • I am so so sorry to read your story here – i cried for you as a mum also – you deserve better my sweet girl. i wish I could help you more – but feel free to contact me and I can offer some moral support at least

49. Hi All, thank you for your comments, and I do appreciate you telling me of your own experiences. Its hard to believe that NZ can run such a system with no thought to the child’s well-being. I don’t care how many people use the line – “its for the child’s best interest”, its just a cover up for the court system to manipulate the system for their own needs and statistics. My son was appointed a barrister and although my son stated he wanted to go back to the UK – that was never heard in court – and what he wanted had no baring on their decision – ‘For the child’s best interests’???

    Maybe its time the courts started to look at the FULL picture – and not just from just one side 🙂

50. Hi All.
    I’m a British citizen – so are my two children and ex husband, but I have been served with a prevention from removing my youngest son from NZ. I moved to NZ 6 years ago for my husbands work (and we all became residences). I separated from my husband last year because he physically abused my 15 year of son, and he was also having an affair behind my back. I have no family here and I feel so isolated. Can New Zealand really issue a British citizen a ‘prevention from removing a child from NZ’ when even the father is a British Citizen – it doesn’t make sense.

    • Yes, it does not matter where your children are born or even if they are British in their culture or accents. It does not matter that they have British citizenship and not New Zealand citizenship. It does not matter that one sibling is elsewhere or is old enough to have his own opinion about where to live. You have a much, much better chance of being allowed to leave, however,.than if you were married to a Kiwi. Marry a Kiwi and you are simply screwed. You do hear boasts about how great their system is, I have no clue where they get that idea. It takes years to proceed though the courts, and is very expensive unless you can prove indigency. Many people underwork, or move in with a boyfriend or girlfriend, for that purpose alone. The process is a combination of mud slinging and “dealing”. No objective study of your case will be done, or if done, it will not be paid attention to in court. If you did a runner, he would be able to pull you back to New Zealand, and New Zealand would pay his legal bills. It does not matter what your husband did to the children or to you, unless he fractured your skull or the like, if you could even prove you were “not at fault” in the act, but otherwise, it does not matter to the court what the father does. It is only “how long you have lived in New Zealand”, if he has managed to prevent you from returning to the UK because you needed his co-operation to leave or were hoping to get it rather than just “run”, then he has made a jurisdiction grab and nothing else matters. He has won the game for years to come. Still, with only one younger child at stake, they will listen to his opinion more in 5-6 years and you may have a small chance of leaving then. Otherwise you are a prisoner until he or she is 16. By then the child may be a settled teen with friends, and not want to leave, anyway. The only time court proceedings happen quickly in New Zealand is if they want to drag someone back. Then they can have proceedings expedited. This is never in favor of the running parent, however. Do NOT move to New Zealand to help your marriage, and do not move to New Zealand with children from another country unless you completely trust your spouse. If there are children involved, and you do not like living there, see a lawyer as soon as you can. Don’t wait to “persuade” your spouse that you do not like it. You do not even have to be married to the person. Common-law partners with children are also affected by the steel net they can throw over you.

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